A&H

Leicester v Wolves

Don't paint it like we're sitting there outside of IFAB meetings chanting 'ruin the game!'
My side is more difficult to argue than yours (and @RustyRef 's)
One of the EPL top refs has just awarded this kick after watching the replay in slow motion. So yes, it would appear that the PGMOL are still interpreting the vagary of the Law in this damaging way. As I pointed out earlier in the thread, I thought it was clear after the Dier incident, that they were intent on relaxing their approach. This decision today is depressingly contradictory
I don't get why our top refs would throw us all under a bus with this unnecessary establishment of fact, when there's more than enough vagary to avoid doing so. Anyone blindly following them would be complicit in doing wrong by the game, taking our reputation (as a community of referees) to new depths. Difficult to communicate emotive stuff on a forum, but my fur is proper ruffled by all this nonsense
Sorry, I thought I'd already signed off :oops:
 
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My side is more difficult to argue than yours (and @RustyRef 's)
One of the EPL top refs has just awarded this kick after watching the replay in slow motion. So yes, it would appear that the PGMOL are still interpreting the vagary of the Law in this damaging way. As I pointed out earlier in the thread, I thought it was clear after the Dier incident, that they were intent on relaxing their approach. This decision today is depressingly contradictory
I don't get why our top refs would throw us all under a bus with this unnecessary establishment of fact, when there's more than enough vagary to avoid doing so. Anyone blindly following them would be complicit in doing wrong by the game, taking our reputation (as a community of referees) to new depths. Difficult to communicate emotive stuff on a forum, but my fur is proper ruffled by all this nonsense
Sorry, I thought I'd already signed off :oops:

But compared to some of the very soft penalties for handling in Europe recently this was stonewall in comparison. It isn't a PGMOL thing, rather FIFA and IFAB want penalties given for things like this. PGMOL have tried to use a different tolerance to handling until this season but have now seemingly been told to use VAR properly or face the consequences.

There would be absolutely no debate had Kilman been penalised for handball if it had been a game in Spain, Portugal, France, etc. In England we need to get it out of our heads that we can apply our own handball interpretations as we have been doing for years, as that option has gone now, or at least it has gone at the top levels anyway.
 
But compared to some of the very soft penalties for handling in Europe recently this was stonewall in comparison. It isn't a PGMOL thing, rather FIFA and IFAB want penalties given for things like this. PGMOL have tried to use a different tolerance to handling until this season but have now seemingly been told to use VAR properly or face the consequences.

There would be absolutely no debate had Kilman been penalised for handball if it had been a game in Spain, Portugal, France, etc. In England we need to get it out of our heads that we can apply our own handball interpretations as we have been doing for years, as that option has gone now, or at least it has gone at the top levels anyway.
I was among a dwindling minority of the TV audience watching the FA Cup Highlights this afternoon. Not one of them marred by stupid refereeing nonsense. I understand that the same thing happened against Gomez. I therefore have to accept that you were right in stating these are HB in the EPL and I was wrong for naively believing the misreporting that PGMOL were intent on softening this 'interpretation'
Based on what's printed in this year's book, I remain firm that it's more correct in Law to deem these accidental (non-offence) than it is call an offence
So why is this an issue in so many top-flight games, yet quite rare in the lower leagues? It's just another implication of VAR and the misuse of it
 
So why is this an issue in so many top-flight games, yet quite rare in the lower leagues? It's just another implication of VAR and the misuse of it
Due to COVID I've yet to referee a game this year but if it is a case I suspect it's referees being less willing to apply the law to the letter - match control is key on a Sunday morning, PL referees have to be stricter*

*with some laws ;)
 
I was among a dwindling minority of the TV audience watching the FA Cup Highlights this afternoon. Not one of them marred by stupid refereeing nonsense. I understand that the same thing happened against Gomez. I therefore have to accept that you were right in stating these are HB in the EPL and I was wrong for naively believing the misreporting that PGMOL were intent on softening this 'interpretation'
Based on what's printed in this year's book, I remain firm that it's more correct in Law to deem these accidental (non-offence) than it is call an offence
So why is this an issue in so many top-flight games, yet quite rare in the lower leagues? It's just another implication of VAR and the misuse of it

Simple really, at lower levels you get one look at it and have to make a judgement. Handball calls have always been difficult, especially when the ball is travelling at pace, and if you aren't sure you aren't going to give handball.

VAR changes that. After all, how many of the handball penalties in the EPL this season have been given by the referee as opposed to initiated by VAR? I'm struggling to think of many, if any.
 
Simple really, at lower levels you get one look at it and have to make a judgement. Handball calls have always been difficult, especially when the ball is travelling at pace, and if you aren't sure you aren't going to give handball.

VAR changes that. After all, how many of the handball penalties in the EPL this season have been given by the referee as opposed to initiated by VAR? I'm struggling to think of many, if any.
Michael Oliver gave the one in Liverpool V Leeds. I can't think of too many others.
 
The only natural hand/arm position for a defender in the penalty area is for the hands to befirmly tied to each other behind the their back. Why anyone would need to move their arms around while running is beyond me.
 
If you don't now give these, you're penalising the players who unnaturally tuck their arms into the body so they don't give away penalties.
 
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