A&H

Junior/Youth First Match

Danny1988

New Member
Completed my first game yesterday, prepared well, communicated with clubs and got there in plenty of time.

First problem:- Home coach asked if he could pay me straight away to which I said Yeah thats ok but then he wasnt happy at the fee and I heard him go and tell his players that it was ridiculous which in my opinion effects their attitude to a referee. I dont set the fees.

Second problem:- Home coach refused to do the line or to even ask somebody else to do the line which led to nobody doing the flag which then had players complaining at every decision made and led to 2 cautions for how players behaved.

I ran the game in good faith which finished 4-3 and called it as i saw it but I just think that at grassroots level, clubs should be expected to help the referee out with the line and already know the charges.

Any thoughts?
 
The Referee Store
Well don't for stamping on poor behaviour right from the first game. Even if it was ONLY two cautions :)
 
1. Tell the League. They can send a reminder to the Club that by participating in the League they have agreed to the Competition rules - which includes the referee fee. Some (not many) clubs I deal with have good committees and have been known to fine poor managers. The League should be aware anyway.

2. Again let the League know. The competition rules may state if Clubs are expected to provide CARs. I would have zero tolerance for Dissent on offside calls in your scenario.
 
In the leagues here in Western Australia the clubs each have to provide someone to run the line. If they cannot do so they forfeit the game. In nine years here I have never once not had CAR's
 
Second problem:- Home coach refused to do the line or to even ask somebody else to do the line which led to nobody doing the flag which then had players complaining at every decision made and led to 2 cautions for how players behaved.

I ran the game in good faith which finished 4-3 and called it as i saw it but I just think that at grassroots level, clubs should be expected to help the referee out with the line and already know the charges.

Any thoughts?

Research the league's rules.

If the rules state that clubs are to provide a CAR then that's what they should do - if they don't then just report it.

If there's nothing explicitly laid out in the rules about CARs then you've just got to get on with it. You certainly won't make any friends by refusing to start the match so I'd advise against that personally. "Spirit of the game" and all that ... so (IMO) you did right to carry on. ;)

In one of the leagues I operate in, the rules are quite clear that Premier and Division 1 teams have to provide a CAR who also has to be named on the team sheet - I even have to score them for attitude/performance in my post match report card. On the odd occasion, a team has been missing a couple of players/subs and so the coach has had to pick the flag up. ;) If he hadn't, I'd have still done the game to the best of my ability but made sure it was reported to the league.

As for the match fee business - no excuses. It matters not what the coach/players or even you think is "appropriate". The fees should be laid down in the league/competition rules and that's what gets paid. :)
 
I think I did 498/500 games without qualified Linos, I even managed to do one on a current Premier League ground too with nooooo problems whatsoever.... How did I cope I’m not sure 😁
Throwing the word "qualified" in there changes the context a little, don't you think?


Anyway, to the OP, knowing your league rules is key. It might be that they have to provide an AR or the game doesn't go ahead - or it might be (as is the case in most grassroots leagues around me) that they do have to provide one, but the punishment is a fine rather than forfeiting the match.

Either way, it's worth taking the time pre-match to discuss with the captain of that team that having no AR means you'll have to take educated guesses from whatever position you find yourself in, and if in doubt you'll probably go with the attacking side. That might not necessarily be true, but it should cover your back if you let a borderline one go. And it will be something to point at if you have to book someone for arguing with your decision.
 
Throwing the word "qualified" in there changes the context a little, don't you think?.

Ok, add about a dozen games ruined by clueless subs or parents. They generally haven’t a clue if we are all being totally honest and chuck into the being biased it’s a licence to spoil a game. I sacked them off very early. I can manage that element myself without any help from others 🥴
 
Never used CARs, we don't have them in Sheffield. I played amateur football in Manchester towards the end of my playing career and we had to provide CARs. Every player did as bad a job as possible so that they didn't get chosen again. Half the time the flag was on the floor following the CAR getting subbed on and no one else replacing him. They were never up with play and just couldn't be bothered with it.

I'm sure some clubs had good CARs, but in my experience there weren't many. I'd much rather do it on my own and ill tell the players that I'm doing the best from the middle and its unlikely that I'll get them all right. First sign of dissent I'll warn, anymore and then it's 10 mins in the bin for the offender. Only had to do that once twice year and once I did it nobody moaned much after.

Given the choice id never bother with CARs. I don't need the extra ****
 
Completed my first game yesterday, prepared well, communicated with clubs and got there in plenty of time.

First problem:- Home coach asked if he could pay me straight away to which I said Yeah thats ok but then he wasnt happy at the fee and I heard him go and tell his players that it was ridiculous which in my opinion effects their attitude to a referee. I dont set the fees.

Second problem:- Home coach refused to do the line or to even ask somebody else to do the line which led to nobody doing the flag which then had players complaining at every decision made and led to 2 cautions for how players behaved.

I ran the game in good faith which finished 4-3 and called it as i saw it but I just think that at grassroots level, clubs should be expected to help the referee out with the line and already know the charges.

Any thoughts?

As for the moaning about offside calls. Just be strong. Don't get into debates, don't try to appease or show that it's bothered you. Justclearly state that you're going to give an honest decision from where you are and if anyone disagrees then that's fine, but you're not changing it. Repeat....
 
Well done on your first game. In the youth and OA leagues I have been refereeing on clubs are asked to have somebody with the flag to signal out of play. I talk to the managers about I will call offside to the best of my knowledge but just have to accept that there will be times when it is wrong and it's same for both teams. I think it is better than having some club assistants ruin the game as they sometimes do.

If I'm up with play I can at least be credibly wrong, if it's cleared from a corner and km still on the by line dont even expect me to call an offside.

As for the attitude about fees the league sets the match fee
 
like others have said, know the league rules. Most leagues will send you a handbook. If not the league rules will be available on line from their website normally. It's worth reading them and worth looking at the fines the league issues in particular for not providing a club assistant ref. I've only ever had 1 refusal, well I say refusal when I handed him a flag, he looked at me like I'd just shat in his boots. He put it on the floor and walked away. When I reminded him that it was a £30 fine for refusing and could he just confirm that he was refusing, he picked it up. unrelated to this, I sent him off after 15 mins for offinabus and reported his team for failing to provide a CAR from that point onwards.
 
- Home coach refused to do the line or to even ask somebody else to do the line which led to nobody doing the flag which then had players complaining at every decision made and led to 2 cautions for how players behaved.

Report him.

Might seem petty, but if it's in the league rules, do it. I know for mine, the rules mandate that each club must provide an assistant, and if you report him and he gets his £10 fine or whatever, it'll teach him not to do it again, unless he's happy to shell out an extra tenner a week? :p
 
Had a match a few weeks ago, tge away team only had 10 players, and team officials so there was no one from their team to be CAR. They were happy for the other team to do both lines, had a chat with the other team and after the vote they were happy to do both.

A good game of football followed with the CARs being one of the better ones I've dealt with. One assistant even gave his team mate offside when he scored.

I previously had a team refuse to give me a CAR and decided to do the game without any as im used to that on my other league. The away team won 11-1 but i disallowed a goal for offside, which ended up with their attacker being dismissed for OFFINABUS. The away team complained to the league that i didn't use CARs. Since then i tell the teams it's in the league rules, and i wouldn't do it by myself again if the league rules state they need to. I would only have one CAR (from the team happy to provide one) as the league confirmed that would have been okay.
 
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