A&H

3 Games In

S

Smudge

New Member
Hi all,

I completed my referees course over the summer and I’m now 3 middles in on a local youth league (have also been doing a few lines on a U18 league)

First few games have been relatively trouble free, today I had an U16 game today and did what I’ve been doing in the previous games with trying to let games flow and not stopping for every little push etc. Today I had both teams moaning about every challenge or decision I gave. I gave two players a final warning for dissent which then ending up with one of them recieving a booking 30 seconds from time for dissent, looking back this could also potentially have been a red for OFFINABUS.

I think potentially I may be letting too many little things go early in the game and unconsciously avoiding cards due to the ages I’ve been reffing, an early card may have cut off the dissent. I also contemplated bringing the two captains in 10 minutes before the end with a quick chat of let’s play football or we can blow up for every challenge, I didn’t do this and looking back I think this may have diffused the last 10.

I’ve read the horse analogy on here a few times and today was probably the perfect example. Any tips on trying to let the game flow but keeping the players in check?
 
The Referee Store
Yes!

booking 30 secs from time for dissent is weak and means your other warnings fell on deaf ears

for me you answered it yourself.....letting things go to early. Where you in control of horsey? Could you let horsey off its reigns and roam free? if not, then, keep it under control by whatever mean you have at your disposal !

captains 10 mins to go? pointless.
captains 10 mins in? not my thing but i can understand the merits.

why avoid cards? are the rules diff for diff ages?

DONT LET THE HORSE RUN FREE UNTIL ITS TOTALLY UNDER CONTROL !
 
Smudge said:
Hi all,

I completed my referees course over the summer and I’m now 3 middles in on a local youth league (have also been doing a few lines on a U18 league)

First few games have been relatively trouble free, today I had an U16 game today and did what I’ve been doing in the previous games with trying to let games flow and not stopping for every little push etc. Today I had both teams moaning about every challenge or decision I gave. I gave two players a final warning for dissent which then ending up with one of them recieving a booking 30 seconds from time for dissent, looking back this could also potentially have been a red for OFFINABUS.

I think potentially I may be letting too many little things go early in the game and unconsciously avoiding cards due to the ages I’ve been reffing, an early card may have cut off the dissent. I also contemplated bringing the two captains in 10 minutes before the end with a quick chat of let’s play football or we can blow up for every challenge, I didn’t do this and looking back I think this may have diffused the last 10.

I’ve read the horse analogy on here a few times and today was probably the perfect example. Any tips on trying to let the game flow but keeping the players in check?
Click to expand...
The old hands like @Padfoot @Mintyref and @Sheffields Finest will point you in the right direction
Not sure @Ciley Myrus is as old!
Camp fires lead to bush fires etc
 
Smudge said:
Hi all,

I completed my referees course over the summer and I’m now 3 middles in on a local youth league (have also been doing a few lines on a U18 league)

First few games have been relatively trouble free, today I had an U16 game today and did what I’ve been doing in the previous games with trying to let games flow and not stopping for every little push etc. Today I had both teams moaning about every challenge or decision I gave. I gave two players a final warning for dissent which then ending up with one of them recieving a booking 30 seconds from time for dissent, looking back this could also potentially have been a red for OFFINABUS.

I think potentially I may be letting too many little things go early in the game and unconsciously avoiding cards due to the ages I’ve been reffing, an early card may have cut off the dissent. I also contemplated bringing the two captains in 10 minutes before the end with a quick chat of let’s play football or we can blow up for every challenge, I didn’t do this and looking back I think this may have diffused the last 10.

I’ve read the horse analogy on here a few times and today was probably the perfect example. Any tips on trying to let the game flow but keeping the players in check?
Click to expand...
3 games in you are doing amazingly well to identify this and question yourself.
Really. Hats off. This is already advanced!

Under 16-18 the players are probably genuinely moaning because they disagree with you. At OA it is more likely to be (subconscious maybe) attempts to undermine you.

Either way it is low level dissent. The only way is to catch it when it starts. At the first low level dissent take action. Doesn’t mean card or captains necessarily.

If it’s mild and the game is dead, isolate the player and warn them. It’s not really a warning for the player, it’s for the whole family. Stand up, tell him/her not to complain, make duck/quack fingers or cut rhe grass so everyone knows.

Don’t threaten “next time yellow” because you don’t want to dig a hole.

By doing this it means you can act more easily if something else happens. And you are much less likeky to have a 2-3-4 player chain of minor niggly dissent. You also show calmt that you are in control.

Took me 4 years to get this BTW!
 
Smudge said:
I contemplated bringing the two captains in 10 minutes before the end with a quick chat of let’s play football or we can blow up for every challenge, I didn’t do this and looking back I think this may have diffused the last 10.
Click to expand...

the only reason to speak to both captains this close to the end to tell them to control their players, or the cards will flow. It might take 3 cards for them to work, but they can't say they wasn't warned. Dont threaten that you will start giving free kicks.
 
Thanks all, going to definitely reign the horse in the future, I’ve coached on this league for the last year or so too albeit as U13/U14 so think I may have allowed my thinking to be influenced by what other refs have let go etc, clean slate next week and start again!
 
Ciley Myrus said:
Yes!

booking 30 secs from time for dissent is weak and means your other warnings fell on deaf ears

for me you answered it yourself.....letting things go to early. Where you in control of horsey? Could you let horsey off its reigns and roam free? if not, then, keep it under control by whatever mean you have at your disposal !

captains 10 mins to go? pointless.
captains 10 mins in? not my thing but i can understand the merits.

why avoid cards? are the rules diff for diff ages?

DONT LET THE HORSE RUN FREE UNTIL ITS TOTALLY UNDER CONTROL !
Click to expand...
I've noticed a huge difference being right on top and giving everything in first 10-15 mins, improves my match control so much, less chance of losing the game early on.
 
YES!!

ok, not just a horse but...am orchestra ?

who speeds it up, slows it down, makes it calm.....

u


horses can be wild...get to know them...assess them.....suss them out...before letting them loose....
 
Smudge said:
Thanks all, going to definitely reign the horse in the future, I’ve coached on this league for the last year or so too albeit as U13/U14 so think I may have allowed my thinking to be influenced by what other refs have let go etc, clean slate next week and start again!
Click to expand...



YES!!

your game is YOUR horse.....do what YOU need to keep it under control
 
lincs22 said:
the only reason to speak to both captains this close to the end to tell them to control their players, or the cards will flow. It might take 3 cards for them to work, but they can't say they wasn't warned. Dont threaten that you will start giving free kicks.
Click to expand...



If you are talking to captains 10 mins from time. for me..you are reaching to last chance help 99% of the time
today I watched Hearts Celtic and Willie Collum had a good game, tried to manage as much as could...avoided a silly 2nd yellow by being proactive....rare
we are not all our counties best ref....
10 mins from time//your talking should have been done by now.....
 
Ciley Myrus said:
If you are talking to captains 10 mins from time. for me..you are reaching to last chance help 99% of the time
today I watched Hearts Celtic and Willie Collum had a good game, tried to manage as much as could...avoided a silly 2nd yellow by being proactive....rare
we are not all our counties best ref....
10 mins from time//your talking should have been done by now.....
Click to expand...
All depends on game and context of. Plenty games where you get nothing for 80 mins then 10 from time someone wants to get a little silly.
No harm in a little chat and reminding them of where we are in the game and how we got here.
 
JamesL said:
All depends on game and context of. Plenty games where you get nothing for 80 mins then 10 from time someone wants to get a little silly.
No harm in a little chat and reminding them of where we are in the game and how we got here.
Click to expand...



Yes, 99% was a bit extreme I guess....90% is more reasonable! that gives us the other 10% for the situation you describe.
 
QPR v Aston Villa - was on Sky, so some of you may have seen it.

It was below me and the cameras, so didn't see exactly what went on, but Aston Villa player 'got involved' with the (QPR) crowd about 88th min.

Referee spoke to him with the captain - not quite sure why captain involved. It was 2nd/3rd incident where us wonderfully sporting Rs fans had kept the ball or thrown it away from Villa players, so guessing referee was warning captain to tell players not to get involved with the crowd - lovely as we are!;)
 
I went to QPR in the early 90s, looked a nice small modern crinkly tin stadium back then. Have they done anything with the place since?
 
Sheffields Finest said:
I went to QPR in the early 90s, looked a nice small modern crinkly tin stadium back then. Have they done anything with the place since?
Click to expand...

No!

That's the quandry. Some (majority?) love the place and the fact that you can , literally, get in the players' faces, against that is the fact that the seats are tiny, the leg room non existent and the food/toilet facilities primitive by modern day standards. Add to that the fact that we only get 15,000 plus on half a dozen occasions while in the 2nd tier and many say 'Why move?'

The club say non matchday revenues are nil because a) there is literally no parking on site and b) the biggest room in the stadium holds 50 people at a push!

I think we will move, but whether its in my lifetime is another matter!
 
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