The Ref Stop

Manager bawling out their own player

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lawriejones

New Member
Level 7 Referee
Hi! Please can I ask for your advice about a match I was reffing?

A manager is getting increasingly vocal during a match, but only giving criticism to his own (U15 girls) players. What started off as an irritation for the squad becomes more uncomfortable for them, with one being pushed to the verge of tears. At a break in play I asked the manager to calm it down and he did rein it in a bit. My question is, if he had not and a stepped approach had failed to get him back on track, what caution would it be for if it continues to escalate?

What if the manager had been engaging with an opposing player? Is anything different?
 
The Ref Stop
lawriejones said:
Hi! Please can I ask for your advice about a match I was reffing?

A manager is getting increasingly vocal during a match, but only giving criticism to his own (U15 girls) players. What started off as an irritation for the squad becomes more uncomfortable for them, with one being pushed to the verge of tears. At a break in play I asked the manager to calm it down and he did rein it in a bit. My question is, if he had not and a stepped approach had failed to get him back on track, what caution would it be for if it continues to escalate?

What if the manager had been engaging with an opposing player? Is anything different?
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Pick and choose your fights. You won't be short of options. Very likely you don't need to go there with this one. You can't right all the world's wrongs, only the ones you're paid to make your business. Even if it was opposition players, it depends on what's being said and how it's said
 
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lawriejones said:
Hi! Please can I ask for your advice about a match I was reffing?

A manager is getting increasingly vocal during a match, but only giving criticism to his own (U15 girls) players. What started off as an irritation for the squad becomes more uncomfortable for them, with one being pushed to the verge of tears. At a break in play I asked the manager to calm it down and he did rein it in a bit. My question is, if he had not and a stepped approach had failed to get him back on track, what caution would it be for if it continues to escalate?

What if the manager had been engaging with an opposing player? Is anything different?
Click to expand...
In view of the age of the players you are within your rights to remind the manager about his Safeguarding responsibilities, and the fact that you are also responsible for the wellbeing of players.
If he continues you have the option to caution the manager, which should make him think twice. If that doesn't work then you can caution a second time, which removes him from the game.
As it is a youth game, he can only be sent away if there is a responsible adult with the relevant Safeguarding certificate in place.
If the manager is the Qualified First Aider, he can stay in that role as long as he shuts up.
If he is really daft enough to get near the dismissal stage, use the score in the game as part of the discussion.
"Your team are 3-0 up. If I abandon the game . . . be a shame to undo the team's hard work"
"Your team are losing 1-0. If I abandon the game, guess who gets the points when you appear at the County FA hearing?"
Most importantly act early to set him up for a card if needed. It is usually the case that others in the clique will have a calming word.
 
lawriejones said:
Hi! Please can I ask for your advice about a match I was reffing?

A manager is getting increasingly vocal during a match, but only giving criticism to his own (U15 girls) players. What started off as an irritation for the squad becomes more uncomfortable for them, with one being pushed to the verge of tears. At a break in play I asked the manager to calm it down and he did rein it in a bit. My question is, if he had not and a stepped approach had failed to get him back on track, what caution would it be for if it continues to escalate?

What if the manager had been engaging with an opposing player? Is anything different?
Click to expand...
The Club will have a Club Welfare Officer, as the team is U18. After the match, they should be your first point of contact is you have concerns about the attitude of the manager. Your CFA will be able to provide their contact details, if not listed in the league handbook/on the website.
 
ChasObserverRefDeveloper said:
In view of the age of the players you are within your rights to remind the manager about his Safeguarding responsibilities, and the fact that you are also responsible for the wellbeing of players.
If he continues you have the option to caution the manager, which should make him think twice. If that doesn't work then you can caution a second time, which removes him from the game.
As it is a youth game, he can only be sent away if there is a responsible adult with the relevant Safeguarding certificate in place.
If the manager is the Qualified First Aider, he can stay in that role as long as he shuts up.
If he is really daft enough to get near the dismissal stage, use the score in the game as part of the discussion.
"Your team are 3-0 up. If I abandon the game . . . be a shame to undo the team's hard work"
"Your team are losing 1-0. If I abandon the game, guess who gets the points when you appear at the County FA hearing?"
Most importantly act early to set him up for a card if needed. It is usually the case that others in the clique will have a calming word.
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Thanks very much for this. What would the caution be for if he refused to calm down? Is it unsporting behaviour?
 
I’m with @Big Cat on this. As abhorrent as the behaviour is, unless the criticism/abuse is aimed at the referee or, at this age, the opposition, I struggle to see why a referee would get involved during the game.

Absolutely report it to the league and club afterwards, but if parents are standing idly by it’s not our job to parent for them.
 
The Gump said:
I’m with @Big Cat on this. As abhorrent as the behaviour is, unless the criticism/abuse is aimed at the referee or, at this age, the opposition, I struggle to see why a referee would get involved during the game.

Absolutely report it to the league and club afterwards, but if parents are standing idly by it’s not our job to parent for them.
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Yup, hard to say without being there (YHTBT is the acronym), but pick & choose ur fights and don't right all of the world's wrongs
Only so much can fit on one's plate
 
Perhaps it is the teacher in me coming to the fore, but - with the massive caveat that yhtbt - I’m disagreeing with @Big Cat and @The Gump on this (sorry gents!) these are U15s, I do think you need to get involved at the time (and absolutely must do so after the game and report through the appropriate safeguarding channels.)

U15s might like to think they are tough and hard, but they are still kids, and need our help and protection. I would be calmly, but firmly, telling (not asking) the coach that his language was not appropriate in this setting. If he persisted, I would be telling him that if I heard anymore I would consider abandoning the game.

Although abandoning the game would create a lot of short term drama, I suspect that you probably wouldn’t need to do so (and it seems that @lawriejones prompt intervention at half time resolved the problem) but if you do abandon 90% of people present - players, parents, other coaches - would be supportive of your actions (although many may be silent in their support). This sort of behaviour is wrong, but too often persists as no-one actually calls it out.
 
RefJef said:
with the massive caveat that yhtbt
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Yes, keep in mind I've done all the Safeguarding courses necessary
Maybe you're right that I dismissed the OP too lightly. I have a very strong sense of right and wrong, butI've not come across a Youth Coach/Manager overstepping the mark. Rest assured that whilst I might be somewhat more tolerant than others, It's very likely I'd react more decisively than most if my threshold was breached. I'd just want to confidently satisfy myself that something is my business before making it my business. Quite honestly, I wouldn't then be messing about
 
lawriejones said:
Hi! Please can I ask for your advice about a match I was reffing?

A manager is getting increasingly vocal during a match, but only giving criticism to his own (U15 girls) players. What started off as an irritation for the squad becomes more uncomfortable for them, with one being pushed to the verge of tears. At a break in play I asked the manager to calm it down and he did rein it in a bit. My question is, if he had not and a stepped approach had failed to get him back on track, what caution would it be for if it continues to escalate?

What if the manager had been engaging with an opposing player? Is anything different?
Click to expand...
I'm with RefJef on this. Safeguarding all the way. In the U.S., refs are mandated reporters under our federal Safesport law, though very few know this yet. Same in UK? This IS our business.

These are 14 year-old CHILDREN, not the Arsenal starting eleven - if not us, then who? If a coach is winning games and his players are desired up the food chain, regrettably, no parent is going to step in. There is a LOT of evidence out there that coaches who verbally abuse their players are significantly more likely to commit physical and even sexual abuse against them as well.

In my experience over hundreds of games at U-13 - U-17 (where these behaviors seem the worst), coaches who berate their players are also often the sort who encourage/expect rough play, cheating, and general unacceptable player behavior, not to mention referee disrespect.

True, we are not the child welfare police. But we all need to recognize the legitimacy and appropriateness of our potential/mandated role in these situations and should think through just what would be our own threshold for action.

As far as working within the LOTG, JamesL gave you one Law 12 rationale. Here are a few more...

Warning

• failing to cooperate with a match official

Caution

• acting in a provocative or inflammatory manner

• showing a lack of respect for the game

Sending-off

• using offensive, insulting or abusive language and/or action(s)

• act in a provocative or inflammatory manner

• using offensive, insulting or abusive language and/or action(s)
 
joeref said:
I'm with RefJef on this. Safeguarding all the way. In the U.S., refs are mandated reporters under our federal Safesport law, though very few know this yet. Same in UK? This IS our business.

These are 14 year-old CHILDREN, not the Arsenal starting eleven - if not us, then who? If a coach is winning games and his players are desired up the food chain, regrettably, no parent is going to step in. There is a LOT of evidence out there that coaches who verbally abuse their players are significantly more likely to commit physical and even sexual abuse against them as well.

In my experience over hundreds of games at U-13 - U-17 (where these behaviors seem the worst), coaches who berate their players are also often the sort who encourage/expect rough play, cheating, and general unacceptable player behavior, not to mention referee disrespect.

True, we are not the child welfare police. But we all need to recognize the legitimacy and appropriateness of our potential/mandated role in these situations and should think through just what would be our own threshold for action.

As far as working within the LOTG, JamesL gave you one Law 12 rationale. Here are a few more...

Warning

• failing to cooperate with a match official

Caution

• acting in a provocative or inflammatory manner

• showing a lack of respect for the game

Sending-off

• using offensive, insulting or abusive language and/or action(s)

• act in a provocative or inflammatory manner

• using offensive, insulting or abusive language and/or action(s)
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Agreeing with @joeref on this one. All the actions he listed for card offence are applicable in all situation. These are children, not big league players. They are playing for their own enjoyment. Kids do not deserve to be insulted at or dicouraged by an adult at their growing age. If anyone is in big danger, call emergency services.
 
The Gump said:
I’m with @Big Cat on this. As abhorrent as the behaviour is, unless the criticism/abuse is aimed at the referee or, at this age, the opposition, I struggle to see why a referee would get involved during the game.

Absolutely report it to the league and club afterwards, but if parents are standing idly by it’s not our job to parent for them.
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But this is just a youth game. Coaches shouldn't be yelling at their players in this way. Referees are supposed to be regulating the players, staff, and spectators. And its just common sense to stick up for these players. If the coach is acting unacceptably, the right thing to do is to caution or send him of for his bad behavior.
 
Tingting said:
But this is just a youth game. Coaches shouldn't be yelling at their players in this way. Referees are supposed to be regulating the players, staff, and spectators. And its just common sense to stick up for these players. If the coach is acting unacceptably, the right thing to do is to caution or send him of for his bad behavior.
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It’s not for referees to regulate spectators behaviour, this is down to the club to manage. At least in the UK. The referee can ask the club to deal with a spectator, but it’s not for the referee to do.

It’s also not too easy to dismiss the manager as they may be the only person who can be responsible for the children. Quite often at youth level, the manager will be the only qualified physio and safeguarded etc.
 
Runner Ref said:
It’s not for referees to regulate spectators behaviour, this is down to the club to manage. At least in the UK. The referee can ask the club to deal with a spectator, but it’s not for the referee to do.

It’s also not too easy to dismiss the manager as they may be the only person who can be responsible for the children. Quite often at youth level, the manager will be the only qualified physio and safeguarded etc.
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Well that was what the USSF (United States Soccer Federation) says in its own rulebook. I guess in UK its different with their policies. But at least caution the coach if it gets out of hand. And the spectator one is mainly the parents if they commit violent acts or verbal abuse.
 
Tingting said:
Well that was what the USSF (United States Soccer Federation) says in its own rulebook. I guess in UK its different with their policies. But at least caution the coach if it gets out of hand. And the spectator one is mainly the parents if they commit violent acts or verbal abuse.
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Do you have the quote from the USSF rulebook? I'd be interested to see exactly what it says.
 
Peter Grove said:
Do you have the quote from the USSF rulebook? I'd be interested to see exactly what it says.
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In the American Youth Soccer Organization's (a section of the USSF's youth soccer) Article 9 of the Parent Child Protection, it says that a child may not be abused emotionaly or physically by any adult.
 
Tingting said:
In the American Youth Soccer Organization's (a section of the USSF's youth soccer) Article 9 of the Parent Child Protection, it says that a child may not be abused emotionaly or physically by any adult.
Click to expand...
It also applies in law for child abuse and neglect.
 
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