WTF has a humiliating score line got to do with safeguarding?
Junior/Youth What do I do??
- Thread starter Jack M
- Start date
An OA team in my old Saturday league averaged over 10 goals against 2 seasons ago, nearly 200 goals conceded in 18 games, they finished with 3 points, 1 win.
This last season they have finished on 13 points with a mere 80 goals against in 18 games, 4 wins. Massive improvement, nowhere near promotion but not the wooden spoon either. Sometimes defeats can be used as a positive and you can learn that not everything is sugar coated and you have to buckle up and improve to compete!
This last season they have finished on 13 points with a mere 80 goals against in 18 games, 4 wins. Massive improvement, nowhere near promotion but not the wooden spoon either. Sometimes defeats can be used as a positive and you can learn that not everything is sugar coated and you have to buckle up and improve to compete!
I think safeguarding the wrong term here. However, there is that fine line at primary school age where the kids might just not show up any more if they are battered week to week.
Padfoot
The Persecuted One
So. is that an admission that this a local thing rather than part of the FA regulations?
There are other things that can be done to alleviate such score lines that don't necesstiate a game being abandonded.....which actually flies in the face of the FA's England DNA policy of getting more playing time for players.
Certainly at the younger age groups, coaches could agree to remove or add players to even up the game, coaches could move the focus to passing/movement rather than scoring or even just stop recording the score after a 10 goal difference is reached......no need to stop the game.
How do you think the kids who go 10 goals behind will feel if their game is stopped at that point? Might as well just tell them they are crap and there's no point them continuing to try.
Kids are resilient things......if a young player whose team is losing 10-0 suddenly scores a worldy from 30 yds, that is what he will talk about all week, not the 10-0 loss......but by those guidelines he wouldn't get the chance.
11 v 11 is not primary school.........
RefJef
RefChat Addict
A different sport, a different reason, but one that Inthink is pertinent
Several years ago, I ran a school U14 cricket team. It was early May, cold and damp, we had a block fixture (I.e games from u12-u16) v another school later in the day. The rain was on and off, should we play or cancel?
I still remember the comment from a colleague as we discussed our dilemma:
“We want them (the boys) to come back and play next week”
What he was saying was yes, we could keep the fixture for that day, but it would be constantly rain interrupted, cold and probably not much fun for the boys involved. If they didn’t have a good experience that day, would they be willing to play the next week, probably not?
In my current job, I organise all our school football fixtures - probably in excess of 200 games across the age and ability range this season. Most games are “freindlies” - with my oppos at other Schools we go to great lengths to get the level right: I’d always prefer our teams to lose 4-3 than win 8-0; more enjoyable football for all and far better for everyone’s development as a player.
Several years ago, I ran a school U14 cricket team. It was early May, cold and damp, we had a block fixture (I.e games from u12-u16) v another school later in the day. The rain was on and off, should we play or cancel?
I still remember the comment from a colleague as we discussed our dilemma:
“We want them (the boys) to come back and play next week”
What he was saying was yes, we could keep the fixture for that day, but it would be constantly rain interrupted, cold and probably not much fun for the boys involved. If they didn’t have a good experience that day, would they be willing to play the next week, probably not?
In my current job, I organise all our school football fixtures - probably in excess of 200 games across the age and ability range this season. Most games are “freindlies” - with my oppos at other Schools we go to great lengths to get the level right: I’d always prefer our teams to lose 4-3 than win 8-0; more enjoyable football for all and far better for everyone’s development as a player.
santa sangria
RefChat Addict
Many of the youth leagues here are split into 2-3 seasonal steps with cut offs, so the leagues get smaller and the teams are more even.
I interpret Safeguarding to cover anything which could effect the emotional or physical well being of a child. The kids need to win & lose, but the 'mercy rule' is an example of 'good practise' because annihilation does nothing for a child's development regardless of which team they're on
Kes
I'll Decide ...
Being hammered at sport is naff all to do with safeguarding. If individual leagues etc want to have a rule that games are ditched after a 10 goal deficit is reached, then fine so long as it's in the interests of "sport" and also because it's actually by then a pretty pointless exercise as far as "sport" goes. The world however doesn't run on feelings and kids should learn that sooner rather than later. Competitive sport is ultimately about being better than the other guy/girl/team.
Being hammered 18-nil might not feel very good, but there's little or no difference to being hammered 10-nil and having the referee/teacher have to stop the match because the other team is just going to hammer you more if they don't. The effect is the same. (IMO of course).
Being hammered 18-nil might not feel very good, but there's little or no difference to being hammered 10-nil and having the referee/teacher have to stop the match because the other team is just going to hammer you more if they don't. The effect is the same. (IMO of course).
Bit on the harsh side, but I see what you're sayingBeing hammered at sport is naff all to do with safeguarding. If individual leagues etc want to have a rule that games are ditched after a 10 goal deficit is reached, then fine so long as it's in the interests of "sport" and also because it's actually by then a pretty pointless exercise as far as "sport" goes. The world however doesn't run on feelings and kids should learn that sooner rather than later. Competitive sport is ultimately about being better than the other guy/girl/team.
Being hammered 18-nil might not feel very good, but there's little or no difference to being hammered 10-nil and having the referee/teacher have to stop the match because the other team is just going to hammer you more if they don't. The effect is the same. (IMO of course).
Kes
I'll Decide ...
Whilst there's always the chance of a team suffering a pounding, rather than having a mercy rule, a responsible league should proactively offer mid-season division changes (either up or down as appropriate). Learning how to handle defeat is one thing, keeping kids involved in football through youth and in to OA needs more careful management.
The biggest cause of these types of results in OA football is that many league's have rules stating that new teams must start in the bottom division. In the South Manchester Sunday Leagues I played in for many years, at least 2 new (or reformed teams who had kept many of their players on but decided to fold their club and reform for varying reasons) would enter the bottom division every year. This resulted in many teams with +100 GD and many forfeits towards the end of the season.
As previously mentioned, splitting the league's mid season would and does help in many leagues. Non competitive football is no good to anyone. This cant always be avoided but appropriate steps should be taken to reduce its occurrece
As previously mentioned, splitting the league's mid season would and does help in many leagues. Non competitive football is no good to anyone. This cant always be avoided but appropriate steps should be taken to reduce its occurrece
^Yeah, there's two newly formed clubs here. One is genuinely newly formed, and the other is a breakaway club that has split due to differences between the two sets of players/staff. The breakaway club's origin was in tier 2, and they're starting in tier 5.
Needless to say, they've both rolled over everyone, with results often being in excess of five or six goals. The newly formed club won the lower league cup at well. They might be a bit more competitive in tier 4, though I think both clubs could probably get all the way to tier 2 or 3 before they hit any troubles.
Oh, and one other cause is a club having an exodus of players. One club this season was relegated the previous season and are relegated again this season, with a combined 2 wins over both seasons - enough to make Sunderland blush.
Needless to say, they've both rolled over everyone, with results often being in excess of five or six goals. The newly formed club won the lower league cup at well. They might be a bit more competitive in tier 4, though I think both clubs could probably get all the way to tier 2 or 3 before they hit any troubles.
Oh, and one other cause is a club having an exodus of players. One club this season was relegated the previous season and are relegated again this season, with a combined 2 wins over both seasons - enough to make Sunderland blush.
You'd be wrong then.
When at School I faced a lad who went on to play for Swindon Town in the first year of the Prem and had two spells at MUFC but never in the first team. A certain Fraser £&@t Digby, he went to a rival school across Sheffield, every time we played them at anything he was there! £&@t was good at everything, Rugby, football and best of all Cricket! He opened bat and they got something like 80-1 and he got 70 of them in 10 overs, we were all out for about 12 
and guess who was opening bowler! He had muscles where I didn’t have skin, an adult in a kids body. It was a mismatch in skilll sports, used to try and punch the £&@t at Rugby but he was quite quick too! Bitter? Nah! 
and guess who was opening bowler! He had muscles where I didn’t have skin, an adult in a kids body. It was a mismatch in skilll sports, used to try and punch the £&@t at Rugby but he was quite quick too! Bitter? Nah!
An opinion shared by Kes (and others), but at least they gave a reasoned response, to which I offered acknowledgement. If I've stretched the meaning of Safeguarding, so be it. Not sure what else the mercy rule in Herts could be born out of, or the normal practice of hiding goal difference for all age groups. Over stating the importance of kids welfare by using the wrong term is not the kind of wrong i'll lose any sleep over
Punishing players for being good at football? Absolutely not.
one
RefChat Addict
I used to be part of the committee in a club with 40 or so junior teams (U16 and under) for a few years.
Alomst every single junior teams who got the wooden spoon was dismantled the following year because some players did not re-register and most others going to a different clubs. They generally had to play their last few games short or forfiet. It's a fact. Interpret it whichever way you like.
Alomst every single junior teams who got the wooden spoon was dismantled the following year because some players did not re-register and most others going to a different clubs. They generally had to play their last few games short or forfiet. It's a fact. Interpret it whichever way you like.