A&H

Wolves v Arsenal

JamesL said:
Easy DOGSO.
Distance to goal 20 yds = tick
Direction, general direction of goal = tick
Number of defenders - none = tick
Likelihood of control - almost certain = tick
Click to expand...
For me distance was more like 25 yards and i question the likelihood of control and the player was heading (at the time of contact) closer to the corner flag than the goal. Does that tick all 4 for definite? For me no.
 
The Referee Store
es1 said:
SFP absolutely, but accidental violent conduct?
Click to expand...
Go to push someone away but accidentally catch them in the eye? Or similarly, some kind of tactical point/instruction that results in you accidentally elbowing someone - we've all seen the example of when a referee signals for a throw and decks a player, no reason the same couldn't happen with a player giving instructions.
 
Last edited:
GraemeS said:
Go to push someone away but accidentally catch them in the eye? Or similarly, some kind of tactical point/instruction that results in you accidentally elbowing someone - we've all seen the example of when a referee signals for a throw and decks an opponent, no reason the same couldn't happen with a player giving instructions.
Click to expand...

hmmmmmmm...i'm not 100% convinced (not that it really matters, and i'm not sure it's really worth getting into a detailed deiscussion about!)
 
GraemeS said:
Go to push someone away but accidentally catch them in the eye? Or similarly, some kind of tactical point/instruction that results in you accidentally elbowing someone - we've all seen the example of when a referee signals for a throw and decks an opponent, no reason the same couldn't happen with a player giving instructions.
Click to expand...
Or kicking a water bottle in frustration, and it hitting someone, which was accidental because you hadn't intended it to hit anyone.
Happened in a steel city Derby. A player was subbed, and kicked a water bottle, which inadvertently went into the crowd, Mike Dean called him back from the tunnel and sent him off for Violent Conduct..
The act itself wasn't accidental, and had it not hit someone would have been a caution I expect - or nothing but the outcome made it VC.
 
JamesL said:
Or kicking a water bottle in frustration, and it hitting someone, which was accidental because you hadn't intended it to hit anyone.
Happened in a steel city Derby. A player was subbed, and kicked a water bottle, which inadvertently went into the crowd, Mike Dean called him back from the tunnel and sent him off for Violent Conduct..
The act itself wasn't accidental, and had it not hit someone would have been a caution I expect - or nothing but the outcome made it VC.
Click to expand...

i was thinking something purely accidental, rather than an intentionally stupid act with unintended (but perhaps predictable) consequences.
 
es1 said:
i was thinking something purely accidental, rather than an intentionally stupid act with unintended (but perhaps predictable) consequences.
Click to expand...
Yeh, but it's a real example.. Again it's so unlikely but possible.
Anyway, like you said really not worth a detailed discussion and we have well and truly derailed this one now 🤣
 
  • Like
Reactions: es1
Degnann said:
Just to play devils advocate here. Is it not possible to accidentally be reckless?

Are you saying if no one is observing you and this happens, you are not going to give a red by the current laws in the interest of fairness? By doing that does that not actually mean you are leaning to help one team out by not sending off their player who should be off and therefore not being fair?
Click to expand...

Agree with this. How is it “fair” to take a one on one scoring chance from an attacker?

Take my comments with a measure of bias because my son normally plays either striker or center attacking mid, but it’s entirely not fair to take a scoring chance away in a game that doesn’t always have a lot of them and not properly sanction the defender under the Laws of the Game.
 
Last edited:
JamesL said:
Absolutely it is, and to add to it, also commit SFP/VC accidentally.
Click to expand...
Look at the first Southampton red card. I have no doubt in my mind that the player hasn’t meant that at all - it’s still text book SFP.
Not sure about accidental VC though.
 
If we’re saying Luiz shouldn’t have seen red because he didn’t mean it it makes no sense to show a yellow - after all he didn’t mean it.
 
Degnann said:
Just to play devils advocate here. Is it not possible to accidentally be reckless?

Are you saying if no one is observing you and this happens, you are not going to give a red by the current laws in the interest of fairness? By doing that does that not actually mean you are leaning to help one team out by not sending off their player who should be off and therefore not being fair?
Click to expand...
There's a time and a place for any ITOOTR
 
Big Cat said:
There's a time and a place for any ITOOTR
Click to expand...
Maybe, but the only ITOOTR that would apply here would be is it an attempt for the ball or not. In this case it isn’t.
You stated if you were being observed then it would be red and if you weren’t its a yellow?
 
Kent Ref said:
For me distance was more like 25 yards and i question the likelihood of control and the player was heading (at the time of contact) closer to the corner flag than the goal. Does that tick all 4 for definite? For me no.
Click to expand...
They are considerations... they don't all have to be 100% nailed on... they are just considerations.

(It also says "general" direction..."
 
Kent Ref said:
For me distance was more like 25 yards and i question the likelihood of control and the player was heading (at the time of contact) closer to the corner flag than the goal. Does that tick all 4 for definite? For me no.
Click to expand...
OK. 25 yds. That's still dogso land.
If you look at it again you will see the ball is travelling closer to the goal than the corner flag (the trajectory imo is such that I think I would be going maybe 5-10 yards wide of the post) and the attacker is about 4-5 yds from a slow looping ball.

This is textbook General direction towards goal.
Screenshot_20210203_140225_com.twitter.android.jpg
 
With the speed of the ball i'm not sure where the attacker would have stopped the ball. To me this is not 100% but it's possible. Do we send of for possible or definite DOGSO?
 
What about the red card just for deliberate handball which it looked like too me it was as Leno just smacked the ball away. So even if there was no DOGSO, I would expect a keeper especially to be sent off for that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top