Pilots Drafted In...

[RefereeX]

Pilots Drafted In To Help Top Flight Referees

Currently one of the main headlines on the bbc website.

Yes, not just sport, the whole website.

Yet read the article itself and you'll see that it actually says they've been doing training on communicating in stressful situations, the same as they did last year also.

Made out to be a drastic emergency measure and yet its just routine training. Another example of the mass hysteria being created by the media to put yet more focus on referees.

Article Here

 

[Big Cat]

Pilots Drafted In To Help Top Flight Referees

Currently one of the main headlines on the bbc website.

Yes, not just sport, the whole website.

Yet read the article itself and you'll see that it actually says they've been doing training on communicating in stressful situations, the same as they did last year also.

Made out to be a drastic emergency measure and yet its just routine training. Another example of the mass hysteria being created by the media to put yet more focus on referees.

Article Here

Well VAR has sent out the invitation, the Media were just grateful recipients

I've always said that the airline industry sets the standard for sanitized communication. Shame it's taken them 8 years to reach out for guidance, but better late than never

 

[Runner-Ref]

I imagine pilots would be a great source of education of these kinds of matters.

But surely referees by the time they get to the top level, they should already have the skills for communicating in stressful situations. Just seems like a case of let's do something for the sake of doing it to me.

 

[ChasObserverRefDeveloper]

I imagine pilots would be a great source of education of these kinds of matters.

But surely referees by the time they get to the top level, they should already have the skills for communicating in stressful situations. Just seems like a case of let's do something for the sake of doing it to me.

The article states that the training centres on situations with several voices all in play at once (bit like RefChat!)

 

[RustyRef]

I imagine pilots would be a great source of education of these kinds of matters.

But surely referees by the time they get to the top level, they should already have the skills for communicating in stressful situations. Just seems like a case of let's do something for the sake of doing it to me.

We've all heard how chaotic the VAR audio sounds, you can't operate efficiently in any environment when multiple people are speaking at the same time. Imagine if a plane was in trouble and you had the pilot, co pilot, 3rd officer and air traffic control all shouting instructions, it wouldn't end well. So I can absolutely understand why they can learn from pilots when it comes to communication.

 

[Runner-Ref]

We've all heard how chaotic the VAR audio sounds, you can't operate efficiently in any environment when multiple people are speaking at the same time. Imagine if a plane was in trouble and you had the pilot, co pilot, 3rd officer and air traffic control all shouting instructions, it wouldn't end well. So I can absolutely understand why they can learn from pilots when it comes to communication.

I think you're giving them a bit too much credit. They've been used to using comms for years. The VAR doesn't actually speak that much to the onfield referee, and generally when they do, play is stopped.

Spurs vs Liverpool was a communication error, a very very basic communication error. I'm not buying that we need training from pilots for them to know how to share very basic information!

Had they done this when VAR first came in, I'd maybe say it was a good idea. But this far in, it feels like they're throwing mud at the walls and seeing what sticks.

In most circumstances in which VAR has been seen as gone wrong, its because the VAR has either been too busy or not busy enough. There seems to be a lack of process/authority that allows them to query with the onfield referee as to what they have seen. This isn't a comms matter, it's a process error imo

 

[santa sangria]

Is this a UK problem with the elite referees?

I work with and learn from UEFA trained types in football and futsal and the comms chat is precise, minimal - none of the matey chat. Same with the best young referees at international tournaments. No BS. Just the short words/phrases as trained.

 

[RustyRef]

I think you're giving them a bit too much credit. They've been used to using comms for years. The VAR doesn't actually speak that much to the onfield referee, and generally when they do, play is stopped.

Spurs vs Liverpool was a communication error, a very very basic communication error. I'm not buying that we need training from pilots for them to know how to share very basic information!

Had they done this when VAR first came in, I'd maybe say it was a good idea. But this far in, it feels like they're throwing mud at the walls and seeing what sticks.

In most circumstances in which VAR has been seen as gone wrong, its because the VAR has either been too busy or not busy enough. There seems to be a lack of process/authority that allows them to query with the onfield referee as to what they have seen. This isn't a comms matter, it's a process error imo

I don't just mean the Spurs vs Liverpool incident, on almost all of the incidents shown on the VAR review show it has been a jumbled mess of multiple people speaking at the same time. And that is just the on-field officials, before VAR even gets involved. Almost feels like they are sometimes talking just for the sake of it.

 

[Runner-Ref]

I don't just mean the Spurs vs Liverpool incident, on almost all of the incidents shown on the VAR review show it has been a jumbled mess of multiple people speaking at the same time. And that is just the on-field officials, before VAR even gets involved. Almost feels like they are sometimes talking just for the sake of it.

Speaking on comms in general tends to be okay. The bit you hear from the AR's is fairly standard and has been OK for years- from National League to Premier League

They shouldn't need to bring a 3rd party in to figure out how to talk to each other. Its a tick box to say 'look how we're improving'.

If they want the AR's and referees to improve communication, then they need go train the coaches rather than the officials themselves. But those little bits off the ball from the AR's have been standard for years and were never really an issue

They need to improve the VAR process. As i said above; the VAR needs to be asking onfield ref what they have seen. The fact they don't do this must be down to process, rather than lack of common sense or communication skills

 

[JamesL]

We've all heard how chaotic the VAR audio sounds, you can't operate efficiently in any environment when multiple people are speaking at the same time. Imagine if a plane was in trouble and you had the pilot, co pilot, 3rd officer and air traffic control all shouting instructions, it wouldn't end well. So I can absolutely understand why they can learn from pilots when it comes to communication.

The comms sound chaotic because you can here 2 conversations happening simultaneously.
The referee can't here the VAR until he opens it up, so whilst to the onlooker watching Howard's show it sounds jumbled that's not the real life experience.

 

[RustyRef]

The comms sound chaotic because you can here 2 conversations happening simultaneously.
The referee can't here the VAR until he opens it up, so whilst to the onlooker watching Howard's show it sounds jumbled that's not the real life experience.

I know that, but to me on several occasions the on-pitch official conversation has sounded chaotic. They are doing a full match commentary, and that really isn't necessary.

 

[Runner-Ref]

I know that, but to me on several occasions the on-pitch official conversation has sounded chaotic. They are doing a full match commentary, and that really isn't necessary.

Some officials will have their own little quirks on what they want said etc. But most of the stuff they say has been coached into them. So it's the coaches that should be getting the training as it's them feeding it to the officials

 

[RustyRef]

Some officials will have their own little quirks on what they want said etc. But most of the stuff they say has been coached into them. So it's the coaches that should be getting the training as it's them feeding it to the officials

Don't disagree with that, if they are being given bad advice by coaches then the coaches need to be educated.

 

[socal lurker]

I don’t think the pilots idea is bad at all. Training that is all the same can be boring after a while. Something off the beaten track that is linked can be an interesting tweak. I’m not suggesting that the pilots have it all right and the refs have it all wrong or that it’s exactly the same kind of communication , but hearing about communication in another context could be interesting and have some take always. Sounds like a creative idea to try out to me.

 

[TheFoodieReferee]

To be fair, drafting pilots and atc in is a step in the right direction. They’re so regulated and monitored in what they do, they have to sometimes convey information in a clear and concise way under extreme pressure and stress, it can only surely help them out. You only need to listen to some of the black boxes to hear how calm they are in emergency situations compared to what we hear with var, granted there’s 2 entirely different conversations going on but surely a bit of guidance will help.