Observer comments - thoughts?

[HarryD]

Hi all,

Long time since I last posted. I’ve had an observer make a comment that I wanted your thoughts on because I don’t agree, but wanted some opinions before I phone up county and throw my toys out the pram and appeal the observation etc.

So - 4W to 3W observation. CARs but one of them is a registered referee. Said registered referee informs me that he’s called a cheat. The CAR in question has a daughter currently on the field of play. I therefore have a word with the alleged offender and inform her that I’ve not heard it but should I hear a comment like this, I’d be forced to dismiss her front the field of play.

Apparently, I should have dismissed her and failure to do so is a serious failing in application of law.

I’m aware of law 12’s requirement to dismiss a player guilty of OFFINABUS language or gestures. However, I don’t see how I’m expected to trust an assistant who hasn’t been appointed as a neutral - and has admitted several times he’s only doing this on occasion to help out.

Should I have dismissed, or is the observer wrong to be doing what they’re doing?

Honest thoughts (even if I’ve massively dropped one in this scenario) are appreciated. Thanks!

 

[Anubis]

Will leave a more detailed, and possibly accurate, response for anyone who utilises this sham of a system.

Nailing colours to mast though, without knowledge of the car procedure, and saying am with you, and the observor is not only incorrect, but, unrealistic

the car being a ref does not come into the equation, today, at this game, he is car.

 

[Kent Ref]

Hi all,

Long time since I last posted. I’ve had an observer make a comment that I wanted your thoughts on because I don’t agree, but wanted some opinions before I phone up county and throw my toys out the pram and appeal the observation etc.

So - 4W to 3W observation. CARs but one of them is a registered referee. Said registered referee informs me that he’s called a cheat. The CAR in question has a daughter currently on the field of play. I therefore have a word with the alleged offender and inform her that I’ve not heard it but should I hear a comment like this, I’d be forced to dismiss her front the field of play.

Apparently, I should have dismissed her and failure to do so is a serious failing in application of law.

I’m aware of law 12’s requirement to dismiss a player guilty of OFFINABUS language or gestures. However, I don’t see how I’m expected to trust an assistant who hasn’t been appointed as a neutral - and has admitted several times he’s only doing this on occasion to help out.

Should I have dismissed, or is the observer wrong to be doing what they’re doing?

Honest thoughts (even if I’ve massively dropped one in this scenario) are appreciated. Thanks!

IF you sent off a player for something they allegedy said to a CAR and you did NOT hear it yourself that player would be get off, once the CFA know this information.

I say to CAR's if you are abused by players and I hear it too they're off. If i don't hear it i will warn them and look for any further incidents.

Sending off on the say so of a CAR will cause you problems after the game and maybe during.

 

[es1]

IF you sent off a player for something they allegedy said to a CAR and you did NOT hear it yourself that player would be get off, once the CFA know this information.

I say to CAR's if you are abused by players and I hear it too they're off. If i don't hear it i will warn them and look for any further incidents.

Sending off on the say so of a CAR will cause you problems after the game and maybe during.

I agree with this. They're not 'trusted' with the majority of roles/responsibilities of a full NAR, why let them dictate sendings off?

 

[Russell Jones]

You should definitely appeal. If the observer has said that you should have dismissed based on CAR input then he / she is wrong. The observer's only possible defence that I can see, is if they believe that you personally heard the comment and ignored it.

One possible approach for similar incidents in future is, when warning the player, to ask them what they said to the CAR. Not beyond the realms of possibility that they might incriminate themselves!

 

[Kent Ref]

You should definitely appeal. If the observer has said that you should have dismissed based on CAR input then he / she is wrong. The observer's only possible defence that I can see, is if they believe that you personally heard the comment and ignored it.

One possible approach for similar incidents in future is, when warning the player, to ask them what they said to the CAR. Not beyond the realms of possibility that they might incriminate themselves!

I've done this a few times and twice they did exactly that. A good tactic.

 

[RustyRef]

Unfortunately, despite the vast improvement in observer quality over the past few years there are still some left that haven't read the memos. You appear to have found one of those here, so I would recommend appealing as the observer is incorrect in law. Or at least they are incorrect in saying that you should have sent off for something that you didn't hear and didn't have any neutral colleagues to advise you.

 

[lincs22]

Hi all,

Long time since I last posted. I’ve had an observer make a comment that I wanted your thoughts on because I don’t agree, but wanted some opinions before I phone up county and throw my toys out the pram and appeal the observation etc.

So - 4W to 3W observation. CARs but one of them is a registered referee. Said registered referee informs me that he’s called a cheat. The CAR in question has a daughter currently on the field of play. I therefore have a word with the alleged offender and inform her that I’ve not heard it but should I hear a comment like this, I’d be forced to dismiss her front the field of play.

Apparently, I should have dismissed her and failure to do so is a serious failing in application of law.

I’m aware of law 12’s requirement to dismiss a player guilty of OFFINABUS language or gestures. However, I don’t see how I’m expected to trust an assistant who hasn’t been appointed as a neutral - and has admitted several times he’s only doing this on occasion to help out.

Should I have dismissed, or is the observer wrong to be doing what they’re doing?

Honest thoughts (even if I’ve massively dropped one in this scenario) are appreciated. Thanks!

Hi HarryD

Think of it this way - in the old days, what would you put in your report. I know there is no report for RC; but if they appealed, you would have to say that you dismissed a player on the say so of somebody else. With an NAR, they would be expected to put a report in and your would refer to that.

Yes, the observer is wring in law. If he have adjusted your marks for this, then I would appeal.

The correct response from you is to refer the comments made to your CFA for reference .If they get similar reports from other referees, they may send somebody to watch their matches and if they hear such a comment, report the matter themselves as a member of the FA. If the observer had heard the comments, he can report the matter directly to the CFA (as he is a member of the refereeing team as an observer - what he can't do is tell you what has happened, so you send them off).