The FA have decided not to take retrospective action on Canos after this on Saturday. What do you think? For me, if the ref spots that, he’s off. We’ve seen it so many times where a player slightly moves his head forward to make contact with an opponent and that’s seen as VC, so why not here? Genuinely interested in this.
Headbutt or not?
- Thread starter alexv
- Start date
"Violent conduct is when a player uses or attempts to use excessive force or brutality against an opponent when not challenging for the ball, or against a team-mate, team official, match official, spectator or any other person, regardless of whether contact is made"
Headbutt - Yes
Excessive Force - No
Brutality - No
Maybe on the FOP the ref gives it as a red for match control purposes by I think in terms of a review against the LOTG, correct decision
Headbutt - Yes
Excessive Force - No
Brutality - No
Maybe on the FOP the ref gives it as a red for match control purposes by I think in terms of a review against the LOTG, correct decision
I don't think this was brutality
They were punishing these tame head butts as VC a while back, but the tolerance level has changed
Exactly, but as above I think that's match control. If a player does this in the center circle and everyone in the stadium sees and reacts, the referee gives the red for match control but not even the Leeds player noticed it, that's how weak it was.
Fair enough. I just don’t understand the consistency. For example, there was one a few weeks ago even weaker than this at Bournemouth vs Everton (I think) and the ref sent him off and there were no arguments or appeals. So I don’t get why no retrospective action was taken, as the decision at Bournemouth was correct. I totally agree with the match control bit btw
Richarlison is a good example. The referee sees a headbutt movement, as does the whole stadium. Player has to go for match control purposes.
However, this decision for the Leeds player would be a panel which don't have to take any outside elements into consideration, purely the one moment against the LOTG. But when you compare the two moments for what they are, they are near on identical.
Don't forget thought there's a special LOTG for Leeds supporters where everything goes against them. You can read pages of it on each Twitter post about their club
However, this decision for the Leeds player would be a panel which don't have to take any outside elements into consideration, purely the one moment against the LOTG. But when you compare the two moments for what they are, they are near on identical.
Don't forget thought there's a special LOTG for Leeds supporters where everything goes against them. You can read pages of it on each Twitter post about their club
No need to tell me about thatRicharlison is a good example. The referee sees a headbutt movement, as does the whole stadium. Player has to go for match control purposes.
However, this decision for the Leeds player would be a panel which don't have to take any outside elements into consideration, purely the one moment against the LOTG. But when you compare the two moments for what they are, they are near on identical.
Don't forget thought there's a special LOTG for Leeds supporters where everything goes against them. You can read pages of it on each Twitter post about their club
But yeah, I definitely get what you’re saying
Russell Jones
RefChat Addict
For me, contact like that falls into the camp of 'Adopting an Aggressive Attitude' rather than VC, whether committed on or off the FOP. So if the referee sees this in the moment then he might well go Yellow, hence no retrospective action for a possible Red card offence.
Shame really as it would have sent the correct message that this is wrong! Anyway, just been on eBay and ordered a Leeds United lamp....
Just perfect for the middle of the table!!!
Just perfect for the middle of the table!!!
There should be a law change allowing us to punish pathetic behaviour! Anyhing which we deem to be embarrassing or pathetic such as this nonsense should result in a yellow card. Write it into law. "C8 Embarrassing conduct". These type of incidents and people rolling around pretending to be hurt when someone has touched them are a constant reminder that no matter how much we love football, it's often rather pathetic!
I might still be embittered by an u21 player diving horrendously last weekend and running up to me to show me the scratch on his knee as justification!
I might still be embittered by an u21 player diving horrendously last weekend and running up to me to show me the scratch on his knee as justification!
Nothing 'attitude'y about head butting someone!!! He plain and simple head butted him, that's VC red card, terrible decision..Can Leeds appeal???
Padfoot
The Persecuted One
How force is permissible when initiating head to head contact with an opponent?
So you'd send off 2 players who 'square up' to each other because they initiate head to head contact?
Brutality by definition is 'savage physical violence'. I Fail to see how a headbutt into the guys shoulder blade is even an attempt of that when the force used was so minimal, the player didn't even notice. Would we punish him for VC for using the same force with his hand?
tbf, if he had make contact with the back of his head, that would be seen as vc, he’s just lucky to have missed imo
But in that scenario, VC has a definition regarding striking an opponent in the head or face as VC, but even that states 'unless the force used was negligible' which in this case it definitely was
It’s just confusing because most of the reds we see for headbutts are for slight head movements that barely make any contact, so I’m confused as to why they aren’t all treated the same
That's just football and the above statement can be copied and pasted into any other scenario. It's all subjective
Although I feel that against the LOTG definition this isn't a red, any one of us would be using a card if spotting that in a game and no player on the pitch would argue it.
spuddy1878
RefChat Addict
That is a head butt, im not even sure the Richarlison one was a head butt more of a rubbing heads together.
Cant see how you can have two different outcomes though just because a player isn't on the FOP.
Cant see how you can have two different outcomes though just because a player isn't on the FOP.