A&H

Junior/Youth Yellow card FOR DOGSO?!!

Kes

Kes

I'll Decide ...
I don't do many youth matches. Nearly all my fixtures are adult ones and I prefer it that way.
Was asked to referee an U15's match at the weekend and did so. The match itself was a pretty one-sided affair but something occurred during it which was new to me so obviously I feel compelled to share it here in the hope of garnering useful feedback.

Twenty minutes in. Player through on goal into the penalty area, casually dribbles the ball around the floundering goalkeeper but slightly loses control of the ball which gives said goalkeeper that extra second to scramble back and bring down the player quite deliberately with his arms. The player had by this time regained control of the ball and was about to sidefoot it into an empty net. Definite penalty, definite DOGSO. No question.
After blowing for the penalty, I call the( grinning) goalkeeper over to me and explain to him that his foul play has prevented a goal being scored and proceed to take his name before showing him a red card. His reaction was one of complete amazement. "Aren't you going to just yellow card me then ref?" he said. I explained to him that his offence was an automatic red card and that he should leave the field.
Another player then exchanged jersey and gloves with him and took over in goal for the penalty which was duly scored. As I walked back to the centre circle, the dismissed player's coach called me over and enquired as to why I hadn't just shown their goalkeeper a yellow "as is normal for youth games" and/or just simply insisted that he be substituted instead rather than send him off? I replied to him that I'd acted according to the LOTG and that if any "special rule" regarding Law 12 offences for youth matches existed for this particular league, then I hadn't been made aware of it. The coach seemed to think that there was some sort of unspoken rule that players in youth matches weren't ever sent off but rather were cautioned and then subjected to compulsory substitution by their coach at the request of the referee. (?) He walked away shaking his head, as did I. :cool:
Before I contact the league in question and enquire, has anybody else ever encountered something similar with youth or indeed any other leagues/matches? :)
 
The Referee Store
Don't waste your time contacting the league in my view - you did exactly the right thing. The fact that many refs of the last week variety do this shouldn't stop this week's acting correctly. Because look at what the lack of cards does - the GK thought he could bring down the attacker with impunity, as he would only either a) be cautioned or b) substituted. In other words, he knowingly cheated because previously there have been no real sanctions. From U11 upwards when the full LotG apply, they should be applied: across all football (I don't do Academy football, and would choose not to knowing they follow the principle you outlined above).
 
if players and more importantly coaches cant be bothered learning the laws of the game, thats not a referees problem, well done on doing your job properly
 
SM said:
He could just have been trying it on...
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No, I genuinely believe he believed that SM. Remember, that was also the first thing the goalkeeper said to me when I showed him the red. ;) :)
 
Kes said:
So, it does happen elsewhere then?
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Most definitely - both academies here in Sheffield tell referees that they 'don't bother with cards'. In terms of dissent, or deteriorating behaviour, they must be credited for the fact that their coaches generally read the game well, and substitute players before there is any need to caution them. However, it does feel as though your hands are tied a bit with regards C1 foul tackle offences for example
 
So it seems that this is accepted practice in some circles then! I'm glad I asked the question now. To be honest, if I'd been made aware of that "rule" by a league official or someone beforehand, I'd have probably gone along with it (rightly or wrongly). I just thought I'd pose the question on here before asking the league themselves if it is actually "official" (unofficial) policy. Fact is, there's little or no point in me contacting them now since somebody will twig that I wasn't aware of any "caveats" as soon as they see my dismissal report!!
Thanks for the words of praise and the advice chaps. I certainly don't feel a pratt for having applied the LOTG correctly but will probably look a bit of a pratt to the league in question!! :oops: Wonder if I'll be asked to referee any more games?!! :rolleyes: :p
 
Kes said:
So it seems that this is accepted practice in some circles then! I'm glad I asked the question now. To be honest, if I'd been made aware of that "rule" by a league official or someone beforehand, I'd have probably gone along with it (rightly or wrongly). I just thought I'd pose the question on here before asking the league themselves if it is actually "official" (unofficial) policy. Fact is, there's little or no point in me contacting them now since somebody will twig that I wasn't aware of any "caveats" as soon as they see my dismissal report!!
Thanks for the words of praise and the advice chaps. I certainly don't feel a pratt for having applied the LOTG correctly but will probably look a bit of a pratt to the league in question!! :oops: Wonder if I'll be asked to referee any more games?!! :rolleyes: :p
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if they dont want referees to apply the laws properly, are you sure you want to referee for them
 
I had one in my first season. U12s. Booked a player for a reckless tackle and the coaches said that U13 and below don't get cards. I told them it would be going through much to their chagrin. They then said that they were going to report me to the league for being too strict!!
I told them to go ahead and do it. Get home, call the ref sec who proceeds to phone the club and explain to them that they are morons and tells the coach to go learn the LOTG.
Saw them later in the season and cautioned another player for asking if I was blind. The coach then berated the boy at HT. Made me chuckle
 
jofusref said:
if they dont want referees to apply the laws properly, are you sure you want to referee for them
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Not overly bothered either way to be honest mate. (You're right of course). Like I said at the start of this thread, kid's football ain't really my thang. I did it because I was asked, and would do so again but will referee it according to the LOTG. That way, I'm watertight. ;) :)
 
it is not standard practice not to give cards as per LOTG in any youth league. Red card should have been given.
Academy football is different as it is not practice to card below u16 level. These games are played on a friendly basis and behaviour by coaches and players is far more respectful than you will find on normal youth leagues, both towards officials and opponents. Coaches are not interested in result but on player performance. I have never had an occasion in academy football where a card would be required.
 
Even in the US, I'd be red carding him. I'd put any attempts to get me to rescind it as an obvious attempt to make me break the LOTG in their favor... which never happens needless to say :D
 
Definitely appears to be trying it on. Yellow for DOGSO? That's a new one to me. Is this the same version of the laws of the game that includes "backpass law doesn't apply because I haven't taught them yet", "you can't give foul throws at this age" and "blatant verbal distraction is allowed"?

As discussed on many occasions, what age to start carding is something people will never agree on. There does appear to be an unwritten rule/gentleman's agreement that u12 and below don't received cards. Nearly fell off my chair when one experience referee suggested no player under the age of 18 should be carded!

I have red carded at u12 for more serious offences like SFP/Excessive Force. As far as I am concerned, under 13s and above, it's 11-a-side, so the gloves are off and the full LOTG apply whether they like it or not!
 
happy whistler said:
it is not standard practice not to give cards as per LOTG in any youth league. Red card should have been given.
Academy football is different as it is not practice to card below u16 level. These games are played on a friendly basis and behaviour by coaches and players is far more respectful than you will find on normal youth leagues, both towards officials and opponents. Coaches are not interested in result but on player performance. I have never had an occasion in academy football where a card would be required.
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Whilst I agree that academy games are more likely to avoid having cards, I did have to request a substitution in an U13's game I did for Derby due to an extremely dangerous challenge. The opposition coach (I think it was Barnsley) agreed with me, and promptly gave the player a bollocking, however the lads Dad started mouthing off to me after the game!

Only trouble I've had at an academy game.
 
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