RefSix

Wild MLS playoff game

socal lurker

RefChat Addict
Assuming the link works outside the US, there is a four minute recap video on the right side of the web page.

Wild game goes to KFTM, including a GK 2ct for coming off the line by an inch or two. Not clear from this if called via VAR or called on the field and confirmed by VAR—I think called on the fithe led, as I think MLS would have an OFR. (MLS is still on old Laws, so no verbal and no “reset” of the caution from during the game.)

 

ladbroke8745

RefChat Addict
Level 6 Referee
I'm hoping if VAR got involved at any point that they had an angle in line with the goal line.
When the video shot from behind came up, you see the keeper jump off and dive to save the keeper, but any part of the heel on the line? It looked like it is quite possible it was.
If they didn't, then for me how could they be 100% certain he was not on the line, and with that resulting in a 2nd yellow and a subsequent red that is such a huge huge call.
 

es1

RefChat Addict
Level 4 Referee

What you need is the full 16 mins video. Insane.

You can imagine VAR googling the laws as they're discussing it
 

one

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Level 7 Referee
Not much of what the commentators say I agree with but 100% "what a mess".

You'd hope they has more conclusive evidence than the rear camera to disallow a save and send a keeper off. If they did no point blaming the referees there. All by the book.

But you'd also hope before a knock out game they'd read the couple of pages of law 10 and know what to do to bring the new keeper in without delaying the game over 5 minutes. No doubt the premature full time whistle would not have happened had he not got his himself tied in a knot over the substitution.

Would this game have been replayed if he didn't have VAR and allowed the substitustion?
 

Degnann

SFA Category 1+6
Level 7 Referee
I’m posting before seeing the footage or reading the laws to see if I’m close to knowing or being well off.
Am I right in saying that if the team who had the keeper sent off have a sub left, they can sub a keeper from the bench and if not then an outfield player takes his place?
Both results would also mean the opposing team need to have 1 less taker?
And something to do with the replacement keeper doesn’t take a kick?

Edit : have now watched the clip. Aiaiai, not sure if we will see that ref for a while.
are VAR allowed to intervene even if the sub was incorrect?
 
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one

RefChat Addict
Level 7 Referee
A sent off keeper can only be replaced by an eligible player. You really need to read the laws for knowing what eligible player means and other intricacies. But in simple terms, no substitutions.
 

Jtpetherick1

Well-Known Member
Level 4 Referee
What’s deeply frustrating is that Chapman had a really good 120 minutes with four KMIs spot on on the field. And then this - was sickening to watch the chaos!
 

Degnann

SFA Category 1+6
Level 7 Referee
A sent off keeper can only be replaced by an eligible player. You really need to read the laws for knowing what eligible player means and other intricacies. But in simple terms, no substitutions.
ah right so I see. even if there are substitutions available. This is only for unable to continue i.e injury
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
Level 6 Referee
It went unnoticed, but this calamity was narrowly missed in the Scotland play-off during the week. The Scottish GK was probably off his line when making the winning save. He paused dramatically( the GK), looking at the ref for the final whistle and thankfully for Scotland, that's what he got.
The forensics applied by VAR on PKs (and in particular, KFTPMs), is just another example of a horrible conflict between VAR and the dynamics of the game
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
Level 6 Referee
So it seems like MLS was using last year's rules WRT discipline and KFTPM
Another reason why nobody knows where we're at with the Laws. Tweaks all over the place and relentless 'interpretations'. A complete mess
 

RefIADad

Well-Known Member
Level 7 Referee
So it seems like MLS was using last year's rules WRT discipline and KFTPM
Another reason why nobody knows where we're at with the Laws. Tweaks all over the place and relentless 'interpretations'. A complete mess
The MLS season began in the spring, so they are required to use the 19-20 Laws for the entire season.

It’s one of several reasons why I wish MLS would move to a fall to spring schedule with a winter break.
 

Degnann

SFA Category 1+6
Level 7 Referee
It went unnoticed, but this calamity was narrowly missed in the Scotland play-off during the week. The Scottish GK was probably off his line when making the winning save. He paused dramatically( the GK), looking at the ref for the final whistle and thankfully for Scotland, that's what he got.
The forensics applied by VAR on PKs (and in particular, KFTPMs), is just another example of a horrible conflict between VAR and the dynamics of the game
Dont you bring our national treasure in to this :cry:
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
Level 6 Referee
Dont you bring our national treasure in to this :cry:
Thing is though, your keeper was off his line. He knew it and the ref thought about it, but thankfully then thought better of it. Chaos would've ensued with untold controversy. Me thinks 24/7/365 coverage/farce is what football wants = £££$$$
Anyway, there was a banana skin there that didn't get talked about afterwards, but Scotland qualified which was great
 
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Degnann

SFA Category 1+6
Level 7 Referee
Thing is though, your keeper was off his line. He knew it and the ref thought about it, but thankfully then thought better of it. Chaos would've ensued with untold controversy. Me thinks 24/7/365 coverage/farce is what football wants = £££$$$
Anyway, there was a banana skin there that didn't get talked about afterwards, but Scotland qualified which was great
I’m in absolutely no way of saying this because I’m scottish but I don’t think Marshall is anywhere near off his line.
Infact you’re the only person I’ve seen have this view
 

socal lurker

RefChat Addict
Not much of what the commentators say I agree with but 100% "what a mess".

You'd hope they has more conclusive evidence than the rear camera to disallow a save and send a keeper off. If they did no point blaming the referees there. All by the book.

But you'd also hope before a knock out game they'd read the couple of pages of law 10 and know what to do to bring the new keeper in without delaying the game over 5 minutes. No doubt the premature full time whistle would not have happened had he not got his himself tied in a knot over the substitution.

Would this game have been replayed if he didn't have VAR and allowed the substitustion?
The call was made by the AR on the field, though apparently just through the mics, not by flag. So VAR was looking for an error, not making an initial decision. It looked like the right call (technically) to me. Though I remain a non-fan of theses calls from a trifling perspective, but that’s the way the game is being shaped by VAR.

The subbing GK chaos is an unforgivable fiasco. (I’m curious if Orlando knew they couldn’t and was just trying to ice the kicker by causing a delay?)
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
Level 6 Referee
I’m in absolutely no way of saying this because I’m scottish but I don’t think Marshall is anywhere near off his line.
Infact you’re the only person I’ve seen have this view
I haven't seen a replay TBH
I just thought Marshall 'may' have got away with one. Might have been wrong. It was thought provoking though. Marshall saved, stopped, didn't celebrate, looked at the ref desperately for a couple of seconds, then the final whistle... and breathe
 

Degnann

SFA Category 1+6
Level 7 Referee
I haven't seen a replay TBH
I just thought Marshall 'may' have got away with one. Might have been wrong. It was thought provoking though. Marshall saved, stopped, didn't celebrate, looked at the ref desperately for a couple of seconds, then the final whistle... and breathe
Thats fair enough. I think if you see it in a replay, you’ll perhaps change your mind.
 

Joshref

New Member
Level 7 Referee
Just Marshall's reaction and the delayed FT whistle. I had a horrible vision of VAR forensically ruining another game
Thats fair enough. I think if you see it in a replay, you’ll perhaps change your mind.
Being English, I was watching the game and in real time, I thought Marshall had his foot off the line and I thought the ref was gonna give a retake (as did Marshall from his reaction.) Upon replay though, yes he had his back foot on the line so it was fine
 
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