A&H

Which caution code? (Jewellery)

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Trip

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Level 5 Referee
So today I had to ask a player to remove an item of Jewellery. They returned to the field of play still wearing it. According Law 4 she should be cautioned (and she was) but which caution code is it? C1 (USB) or C3 (persistent infringement) could apply.

If C1, which FA code?
 
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Hmmm. Persistent infringement seems to fit. Is it unsporting? If so it would be UB for unspecified behaviour.

Sorry I couldnt be of help.

Small bugbear of mine that there are mandatory cautions which have no caution code.
 
I think you could go C1 UB although refusal could be C2
C3 sort of fits for coming back on still wearing!
C1 for me
 
Generally, if you ask a player to do something and they refuse, I'd call that dissent by action and put it under C2. I'm not sure if that applies or not if they pretend to follow your instructions but don't!

I'd suggest next time you insist on checking the jewellery has been removed before letting them back on the pitch? That way you can either refuse to let her back on without the change (disadvantaging her team in the process), or get her for reentering without permission if she sneaks on without you letting her check.
 
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I would have said dissent purely because she's just ignored your request
 
I'd be inclined to go for C1 too.

Players' equipment is a "technical" offence so to speak.

You're not specific about the circumstances under which she failed to remove the jewellery item so it's difficult to label it as dissent for me.

Did she leave the field and attempt to remove it only to find that she couldn't (tight ring on finger/hands too cold to remove stud from ear perhaps?) and so she just decided to bluff it and return hoping you'd not notice or just chin it off? If that were the case with jewellery (as it often is) then I'd not view it as dissent.

Either way, if you cautioned her, it makes little difference in the long run. She can't appeal it and it's gonna cost her a tenner whatever code you put in .... ;) :)
 
GraemeS said:
I'd suggest next time you insist on checking the jewellery has been removed before letting them back on the pitch?
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The problem is that the jewellery in question was a belly button piercing. The team was a premiership club's Women's U18. I don't feel comfortable asking a 17 year old girl to show me her belly button. (This is how it got past the pre-match kit check.)
 
Trip said:
The problem is that the jewellery in question was a belly button piercing. The team was a premiership club's Women's U18. I don't feel comfortable asking a 17 year old girl to show me her belly button. (This is how it got past the pre-match kit check.)
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That changes things significantly. I think it is generally accepted that hidden piercings, such as belly button, nipple, prince alberts, etc, are beyond the jurisdiction of the referee as you can't deal with what you can't see. We're not even supposed to ask male players to pull their shorts up any more, and would be on very dodgy ground asking female players to do that, but would be arrested and put on trial asking to check for any of those piercings.

Out of interest, how did you know that she hadn't complied with your instructions?
 
Trip said:
The problem is that the jewellery in question was a belly button piercing. The team was a premiership club's Women's U18. I don't feel comfortable asking a 17 year old girl to show me her belly button. (This is how it got past the pre-match kit check.)
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Fair enough!
 
RustyRef said:
That changes things significantly. I think it is generally accepted that hidden piercings, such as belly button, nipple, prince alberts, etc, are beyond the jurisdiction of the referee as you can't deal with what you can't see. We're not even supposed to ask male players to pull their shorts up any more, and would be on very dodgy ground asking female players to do that, but would be arrested and put on trial asking to check for any of those piercings.

Out of interest, how did you know that she hadn't complied with your instructions?
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I asked all players from both teams to take off any jewellery, and checked. This player had earrings and a necklace and made a big fuss about taking them off.

When she started playing it became obvious that she was also wearing white undershorts with black shorts. We've had explicit instructions from the ref sec not to let that pass. I said to her at a pause in play that they were not legal and could she please not wear them in future. Her response was a tut and an eye-roll.

This player was also the captain. So when, 10 minutes later, she used her shirt to wipe her face, revealing the belly button jewellery, I was not inclined to turn a blind eye. Off she went. About 20 minutes later she did the same thing with her shirt. This jewellery was not just a ring, it had dangly, sparkly bits you could see from 40 yards. I'm surprised I couldn't hear it.
 
OK, so the lesson here to the player is wear an undershirt so that when her main shirt comes up no one can see you have a piercing .. :)

Which is kind of the problem, you might have stopped one problem but there could be 10 other players on that pitch with concealed piercings. I'm not saying you were wrong by the way, but rather this is a bit of an impossible situation to deal with. Let's say they have a shared changing room, if the player you caution points at another player and says "she has a nipple ring" what are you going to do then?
 
RustyRef said:
OK, so the lesson here to the player is wear an undershirt so that when her main shirt comes up no one can see you have a piercing .. :)

Which is kind of the problem, you might have stopped one problem but there could be 10 other players on that pitch with concealed piercings. I'm not saying you were wrong by the way, but rather this is a bit of an impossible situation to deal with. Let's say they have a shared changing room, if the player you caution points at another player and says "she has a nipple ring" what are you going to do then?
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I suppose gather photographic evidence isnt the correct answer here either.. darn it!
 
Trip said:
When she started playing it became obvious that she was also wearing white undershorts with black shorts. We've had explicit instructions from the ref sec not to let that pass. I said to her at a pause in play that they were not legal and could she please not wear them in future. Her response was a tut and an eye-roll.

.
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Sooo....you let it pass then? ;-) Sounds like the instructions were to enforce the law - that is to say, she leaves the field to remove the incorrect undershorts.
Did you do a prematch inspection?

Nothing else you could have done about the belly button piercing - I'm glad that you cautioned when you could easily have turned a blind eye :)
Although by the sounds of it, you might be the first ref who's bothered enforcing the jewellery law to that team!
 
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If am really reading a post about cautioning for belly button piercing then in interest of consistency, please ensure you ask for a display of tadgers in your next game so you can check for Prince Alberts.
 
CapnBloodbeard said:
Well, it sounds like you didn't read it at all :rolleyes::wall:
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Oh I did. So (in one on my made up never gonna happen senarios), you somehow notice pre match she has belly button piercing. Make up your own senario as to how this happens. Is anybody saying she now cant play unless she removes it!!
 
I never allowed jewelry where I saw it but if it was spotted mid game I made them leave the pitch to remove it, restarted the game and didn’t let them on for that extra 10 seconds just to p1ss them off a bit for undermining my pre match request that everything was removed. The one I always found unsafe were the ear lobe rings, removed there was floppy skin with a loop awaiting a stray finger in a header situation. Never happened but I get the FA point that you need to plug things like that if possible.
 
Clearly somebody will have a story to tell and if there has been a serious accident esp involving an opponent then its one accident too far, but

Apart from googling to see that one occassion where in Chile Division 3 (central region), a flapping St Christopher disconnected itself from Joaquins's neck and landed square in Jose's left nostril, at which he inhaled suddenly in shock, causing the offending item to propell itself direct into the inner sanctum of victims brain, rendering him muerto on the spot, (rip Jose), has anybody really had any jewellery related misfortunes, I know I have officiated well over 2000 times and have either been lucky, or, maybe, the accident potential to reality ratio is less than zero per cent


In fact, the only jewellery related story I can recall is a public park ref who upon jumping up prematch to check the stability of goal net to crossbar, got ring finger stuck on net hook and disconnected said finger upon feet landing back on ground 😢
 
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