Robert King
New Member
Is it bad to have the reputation that you won't get a freekick with me reffing unless you actually go to the ground after you receive a kick or shove....?
Reputation
- Thread starter Robert King
- Start date
Players and manages use mind games to try and influence you, rise above it, dont ever bend to their wish either, I had a reputation for not putting up with idiots, the trouble was that kept sending more idiots! 
Robert King
New Member
Thanks, but thats not the issue haha, because they are almost absolutely right
So, do you feel it is an area you may need to improve on? Are you overlooking fouls on the basis a player is staying up, or are you trying to let the game flow as best as it can? Is this part of game management that you may need to be more flexible on?
If it isn't a problem and you are still calling those fouls where a player doesn't go to ground, then I wouldn't worry too much about it.
If it isn't a problem and you are still calling those fouls where a player doesn't go to ground, then I wouldn't worry too much about it.
Robert King
New Member
It's not that I'm overlooking them really, I see them, but don't care 
Meaning: I try to let the game flow as much as possible, and I don't necessarily look at the fouls,but at the player's reactions. So, if someone gets a kick against his leg, but he stays up, keeps dribbling and there are no protests, I let the game flow. If I see the foul and I see the player isnt able to keep on playing, and players start screaming, then I will call the foul.
I don't always do this though, only when I feel like the players can handle it.
And obviously if its a clear foul then I will call it anyway.
Meaning: I try to let the game flow as much as possible, and I don't necessarily look at the fouls,but at the player's reactions. So, if someone gets a kick against his leg, but he stays up, keeps dribbling and there are no protests, I let the game flow. If I see the foul and I see the player isnt able to keep on playing, and players start screaming, then I will call the foul.
I don't always do this though, only when I feel like the players can handle it.
And obviously if its a clear foul then I will call it anyway.
Ciley Myrus
RefChat Addict
Sounds ok until the obv pk is not given cos player aint decapitated
Padfoot
The Persecuted One
Sure there used to something written somewhere about the "trifiling" foul.....not sure whether it was LOTG or FA guidance/interpretation.....but this was designed for the scenario you are describing......where a player gets a little tap on the ankle, that doesn't affect anything, but is still a foul by the letter of the law.
You have to be very careful when choosing to "ignore" these sort of fouls......whilst they may not affect the victim at that point, if they are the recipient of a fair number of these, they will rapidly get the hump. Likewise a team who is having a bad game, or on the wrong end of your decisions are liable to use your non punishment of these as further proof that you are deliberately against them, potentially leading to bigger issues etc.
If players see they can get away with the little nibble at the ankle.....that will increase in both number and intensity......probably not a good idea to ignore these in the first 10 minutes of the game.....only really ignore them when you have the game firmly under control and the players are responding to a more relaxed approach. You can even break it down to individual players......you can easily have one who wouldn't be bothered at all, whereas another would react like you had just violated his elderly grandmother......
Reputation wise, if a number of players or teams are saying that unless they actually end up on the floor, you won't penalise the challenge.....probably not a good one to have. You need to look at why you won't penalise a challenge that is illegal but doesn't result in a player on the floor.....
You have to be very careful when choosing to "ignore" these sort of fouls......whilst they may not affect the victim at that point, if they are the recipient of a fair number of these, they will rapidly get the hump. Likewise a team who is having a bad game, or on the wrong end of your decisions are liable to use your non punishment of these as further proof that you are deliberately against them, potentially leading to bigger issues etc.
If players see they can get away with the little nibble at the ankle.....that will increase in both number and intensity......probably not a good idea to ignore these in the first 10 minutes of the game.....only really ignore them when you have the game firmly under control and the players are responding to a more relaxed approach. You can even break it down to individual players......you can easily have one who wouldn't be bothered at all, whereas another would react like you had just violated his elderly grandmother......
Reputation wise, if a number of players or teams are saying that unless they actually end up on the floor, you won't penalise the challenge.....probably not a good one to have. You need to look at why you won't penalise a challenge that is illegal but doesn't result in a player on the floor.....
santa sangria
RefChat Addict
Of course this would be bad.
But to your later point. Don't ignore. Tell the player(s): "carry on", "only small, keep going"... If it was small, too small for advantage, and the player/team obviously want/s to carry on.
But be careful. If it is a small foul with no attempt to play the ball, borderline reckless, same player repeatedly... Etc. you will lose match control if you don't penalise these fouls appropriately
I think completely ignoring these "minor contacts" is a bad idea, as it can come across as you not seeing it, and lower player's confidence in you.
As @santa sangria suggests, have a library of phrases like "not enough there" and "small contact but no foul" ready to shout out to make it clear that you know what's going on, you saw it and made an active decision that it wasn't a foul. And as @Padfoot suggests, make sure you keep an eye out for if it's always the same player or two who are on the receiving end of these tackles, as it may be an idea to slow things down and give them one every so often. It will make them feel a little bit protected and should stop them trying to find "justice" their own way.
As @santa sangria suggests, have a library of phrases like "not enough there" and "small contact but no foul" ready to shout out to make it clear that you know what's going on, you saw it and made an active decision that it wasn't a foul. And as @Padfoot suggests, make sure you keep an eye out for if it's always the same player or two who are on the receiving end of these tackles, as it may be an idea to slow things down and give them one every so often. It will make them feel a little bit protected and should stop them trying to find "justice" their own way.
CapnBloodbeard
RefChat Addict
Not to mention that a player can keep their feet but still lost the ball as a direct consequence of the foul..
I have a reputation for letting a lot of physical contact go, that's my starting position and as long as the teams accept it and get on with it I won't move away from it. Once one or both teams start taking it too far, or the temperature gets too high, I'll reign it back in and my tolerance level for what constitutes a foul will be significantly reduced. Sometimes I might start a little bit more cautious and then open up if players are being sensible, for example when one or both teams has something of a reputation.
Neil Swarbrick in the Premier League seems to have a similar approach, he lets a hell of a lot go, even Mourinho commended him for it on Monday night.
Neil Swarbrick in the Premier League seems to have a similar approach, he lets a hell of a lot go, even Mourinho commended him for it on Monday night.
I see my younger self reflected in your post. If I may give you some advice, here it is: call what you think it is, judging the action, not the consequences. An innocent tackle may result in no foul and send the recipient to the drydock for a month, and a serious foul play action can end up causing no harm because the offended was lucky.
So simply give what you think you have to give. A player falling to the ground doesn't make the tackle more or less of a foul. I think we agree on this...
A secondary problem may be that your assessment of the actions consistently diverges from that expected by everyone, especially the FA. If obvious fouls look like no fouls for you, then you don't have to work on your personality but on your technique.
I used to be the no-blood-no-foul type of referee, and as you can imagine, many of my games turned into a dissent fest because the players were bloody right. Working on my technique -and being more calmed when officiating- enhanced my abilities, and now most of my games run very smooth and qutite fluid! And I still let a lot of contact, etc., but now I know I'm protecting players appropriately, and they know it.
Good luck, mate!
So simply give what you think you have to give. A player falling to the ground doesn't make the tackle more or less of a foul. I think we agree on this...
A secondary problem may be that your assessment of the actions consistently diverges from that expected by everyone, especially the FA. If obvious fouls look like no fouls for you, then you don't have to work on your personality but on your technique.
I used to be the no-blood-no-foul type of referee, and as you can imagine, many of my games turned into a dissent fest because the players were bloody right. Working on my technique -and being more calmed when officiating- enhanced my abilities, and now most of my games run very smooth and qutite fluid! And I still let a lot of contact, etc., but now I know I'm protecting players appropriately, and they know it.
Good luck, mate!
My second assessment, the assessor came over and said "You do realise they have work in the morning, they'll be a bit sore."
He didn't mark me down over it though, I like to pretend he quite enjoyed it.
Robert King
New Member
Thanks all for your replies!
I don't really have the time to reply on each comment individually, but I do appreciate them all. Thanks for all your tips! I did notice during a match that the players were getting more and more frustrated, especially with each other. However, they just refused to go down. I didn't have many problems though with those players and ended the match with just one yellow card . I never really experience players who stay on their feet, as many players I ref lie down at every opportunity they get (this was before I got my notorious reputation), so that might explain why I have some difficulty handling these particular situations..
I don't really have the time to reply on each comment individually, but I do appreciate them all. Thanks for all your tips! I did notice during a match that the players were getting more and more frustrated, especially with each other. However, they just refused to go down. I didn't have many problems though with those players and ended the match with just one yellow card . I never really experience players who stay on their feet, as many players I ref lie down at every opportunity they get (this was before I got my notorious reputation), so that might explain why I have some difficulty handling these particular situations..
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santa sangria
RefChat Addict
Most of the levels I ref at, the players don't have the ability to decide to go down. The ones with more ability are trying to stay up in the forlorn belief they can bag a worldie! The ones with less ability are, well, not reliable enough to run in a straight line. The higher level games I work on, again, very few teams with players looking to fall over. This could also be a national/cultural thing too...interested to hear from refs further south...
In all my games I dont think I ever saw a player do an 'Alli' as the new phrase goes. Its trained for, its deliberate and TBH he needs a ban or kick up the backside from his manager to stop him doing it! That is a skill to do and to pull off with no-one suspecting!
Missing stuff at all levels happens, we have one pair of eyes, they sometimes dont help in the sense that its too close or too far. All kicks are not fouls, its a contact sport and one mans kick is another mans genuine challenge for the ball. It comes with practice from my experience that you'll spot the intentional foul or genuine attempt to play the ball, its a fine line sometimes and you will get sh1t for it. Set your stall out early and ref according to the temperature of the match. Be prepared to slow things down if it gets techie and let them get on with it if its taken with good spirit.
Like others have said, it will come but dont let it define you in completely missing everything!
Missing stuff at all levels happens, we have one pair of eyes, they sometimes dont help in the sense that its too close or too far. All kicks are not fouls, its a contact sport and one mans kick is another mans genuine challenge for the ball. It comes with practice from my experience that you'll spot the intentional foul or genuine attempt to play the ball, its a fine line sometimes and you will get sh1t for it. Set your stall out early and ref according to the temperature of the match. Be prepared to slow things down if it gets techie and let them get on with it if its taken with good spirit.
Like others have said, it will come but dont let it define you in completely missing everything!
santa sangria
RefChat Addict
...obvs The Shef knows that a genuine attempt to play the ball can also be a foul... I hope
Of course it can be a foul too Santa, it’s about the recognition of the difference as in the OP, football is about opinions, be honest for both teams, say what you see!