RefSix

Offensive, abusive and insulting language

Southend-ref

Southend United Supporter
Level 6 Referee
#1
I had my module 5 on Saturday and the coach said that if somebody swears at you, he (as an assessor) hates to see a yellow card. He said that you either give them a strict word or send them off for the above. He says that yellow card is the wrong decision as it is not dissent, but bad language. Personally, any swearing at me and they're off. Your thoughts...
 

Dave87

Active Member
#2
any swearing at me and they're off.
Every time for me. Football can be a nice game and I wont have any of my games turned into a free-for-all slanging match.

The other week I had a player run past me and say "Your s*** ref." I stopped the game even though the opposition team were on for a promising counter attack called the captain over, told him why I was dismissing the player. The response I got was "don't blame you, (turns to player) serves you right."
 

JimmyT

New Member
Level 6 Referee
#5
I understand the point; either its OFFINABUS or its not, therefore the middle ground yellow is indeed a bit of a cop out. I think you have to be careful however and take tone, aggression, direction, distance and context into consideration. If a player says "ah f***ing hell ref, I hardly touched him" in frustration, hardly looking at you, with frustrated, defensive body language, walks away ready for the free-kick to be taken and intends getting on with the game, surely we just get on with the game and a word in his ear about speaking to you and to be careful is enough? If a player says EXACTLY the same words; "ah f***ing hell ref, I hardly touched him" whilst marching up to you, veins popping, holding the ball, waving it and his spare arm about like a nutter, like he wants to kill you, preventing the game from continuing, in an aggressive, loud voice, this is a different matter.

Direct, personal silliness like, "you are **** ref" is different; its clearly aimed at you, is personal and gets a walk every time. I just think its dangerous to feel like you have to dismiss if you're sworn at. I swear in the pub, at work, at home, as do many others. Are you really offended sufficiently to red card every swear word? I'm just not and know exactly where I draw the line, a little bit of common sense goes a long way in my experience.
 

Tealeaf

Lighting the darkest hour
Staff member
#6
Some assessors need to be re-appraised of the laws. "Bad Language." I should of is bad language (the wrong word, the expression is should have contracted to should've, the 've bit sounding a little like "Of")

Anyway pedantry and flippancy aside, I still can't agree with the all or nothing approach he suggests. His stern word actually contradicts what he is saying. What is his stern word? "Any more of that and you're off?" Why not a caution in this case? Another one of those and he's off too!

Was it OFFENSIVE?
Was it INSULTING?
Was it ABUSIVE?


Any of these three is red. This is where OFFINABUS comes from. These don't even need to be swearing. Cheat is in these criteria. However is "No f--king way" a red when given offside? A caution is probably appropriate here. That is dissent, it's certainly not insulting or abusive, and is not (IMO anyway) intended to cause offence to anyone as the "f---king" is for emphasis alone.
 

Mick.

RefChat Addict
#7
I agree with Tealeaf. It does very much depend on context. I was told f@ck off in the context of "That's a foul player" "F@ck off ref, no way" Got him a yellow for dissent. Just as if he had told me "Get lost ref, no way" The player who told me to " Eat s@it ref" when I cautioned his mate went for a walk.
 

SM

The avuncular one
#11
I have had two incidents over the past seasons where a player has dived/jumped to the floor and sarcastically claimed a foul (after a challenge has resulted in a foul for their opponents).

A caution? What for ref?

Simulation! Only joking, dissent by action.
 

Top man in the parish

Active Member
Level 5 Referee
#12
Agree with the Red Card Dave 87.........but just think........if you'd played an advantage to the opponents (for the swearing offence) and they'd continued downfield and scored.........and THEN you'd come back and dismissed him...........I reckon that assessor would purr like a Cheshire cat mate. Referee/Linesman being sworn at is about the only Red Card offence we don't have to stop the game for if the opposition are away with it, and unless the chap hides in the hole he's already dug for himself, he's toast mate

Oh yes asa rule of thumb:
PUBLIC

PERSONAL

PROVOCATIVE
 

Aled

RefChat Addict
Level 5 Referee
#14
I had one Saturday; "Jesus ref he f***ing clipped my ankle" I call that dissent, just a bit of frustration swearing (Still got a caution)
I also cautioned for simulation on Saturday and the players answer was "You're f***ing kidding me, right?" He almost walked but the captain very sensibly got involved and calmed him down and apologized for his players behavior, problem solved.
 

Colt

Active Member
Level 7 Referee
#15
Heres one:

Someone swears at your Club Assistant but you don't hear it? Do you take your assistants word or ignore it?

I had one Saturday; "Jesus ref he f***ing clipped my ankle" I call that dissent, just a bit of frustration swearing (Still got a caution)
I'm quite lenient on players saying stuff like that because it is pure frustration and I would probably warn him first, if he did it again then fair play I would caution him...
 

Mike

RefChat Addict
#16
This popped up in our Module 5 the other week, the answer was that you can't accept what they say. For all you know, they could be making it up to try and make you send the supposed offender off.
 

Colt

Active Member
Level 7 Referee
#17
This popped up in our Module 5 the other week, the answer was that you can't accept what they say. For all you know, they could be making it up to try and make you send the supposed offender off.
I said that to my assistant and he looked shocked so gave me my flag and walked. He was easily replaced
 

haywain

the voice of reason
Level 7 Referee
#18
Heres one:

Someone swears at your Club Assistant but you don't hear it? Do you take your assistants word or ignore it?
ask the CAR what was said to him. Make a note of what the CAR claims was said and, since it was offinabus, send the player off.

Closest i've come to this scenario was a CAR asking me to keep a check on player x as he, the player, had aimed some choice language at him. Wouldn't tell me the words he'd used tho', so no action taken beyond telling the player to watch his language.
 

haywain

the voice of reason
Level 7 Referee
#20
This popped up in our Module 5 the other week, the answer was that you can't accept what they say. For all you know, they could be making it up to try and make you send the supposed offender off.
Hertfordshire Module 5 coaches, hey, wouldn't trust 'em as far as i could spit
 
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