Newcastle v Brighton

[RayCharles]

Gordon’s red.

Discuss please.

Becoming a ref has had me repeating the laws of the game in discussion with pals etc.

I still have mates saying that red will get overturned.

My take on it is that there isn’t a ref in the world who wouldn’t of given a red for that apparent situation.

 

[BCMilan]

Why overturn ? he shoved his face

 

[RayCharles]

Why not ? he shoved his face

Apparently it was just a push.

 

[BCMilan]

A push to a players face is violent conduct

 

[RayCharles]

A push to a players face is violent conduct

Yes. But you try telling toon fans that. They won’t have it

 

[BCMilan]

Yes. But you try telling toon fans that. They won’t have it

They need to take their black and white striped hats off then. They would agree if it was done against one of their players

 

[BCMilan]

The only person to blame is the player, not the officials

 

[Runner Ref]

A push to a players face is violent conduct

Not necessarily

Please watch from 3 min to 4 min in below clip. Whilst it isn’t necessarily talking about a push to the face, Willie is saying what they are looking for with Violent Conduct

Saying a push to a players face is violent conduct is like saying catching someone high is SFP. And as we’ve seen in recent weeks, that isn’t necessarily the case.

 

[ARF]

Deliberate strike with the hand to the opponent’s head using more than negligible force. It's in the LotG in black and white - it's violent conduct.

 

[JamesL]

Not necessarily

Please watch from 3 min to 4 min in below clip. Whilst it isn’t necessarily talking about a push to the face, Willie is saying what they are looking for with Violent Conduct

Saying a push to a players face is violent conduct is like saying catching someone high is SFP. And as we’ve seen in recent weeks, that isn’t necessarily the case.

Not sure we can quite draw a comparison here. This is below the head/face.

Violent conduct has the clause in about head and face with more than negligible force so if Gordon has pushed someone in the face, that is more than negligible and meets the must be dismissed for violent conduct.

 

[Runner Ref]

Deliberate strike with the hand to the opponent’s head using more than negligible force. It's in the LotG in black and white - it's violent conduct

So if the force is negligible, it isn’t Violent Conduct…….

I agree the Anthony Gordon one was a red card. And quite amusing considering the circumstances in which he did it.

But a phrase such as a push to a players face is violent conduct is not specifically true

 

[one]

I still have mates saying that red will get overturned.

Why overturn ? he shoved his face

I think it has more to do with "overturning" decisions is becoming a norm this season.

On a side note, I still think, at least we as referees, should not be using the term "overturn". Gordon was sent off and did not play the rest of the game. That can not be overturned unless the game is replayed. A bit of still have mates saying that red will get overturned

 

[Russell Jones]

So if the force is negligible, it isn’t Violent Conduct…….

I agree the Anthony Gordon one was a red card. And quite amusing considering the circumstances in which he did it.

But a phrase such as a push to a players face is violent conduct is not specifically true

Theoretically you’re correct. But in reality, the commonly accepted meaning of “push” takes you quickly down a non-negligible route. Push is defined as … to use physical pressure or force, especially with yourhands, in order to move something into a different position, usually one that is further away from you … if a player is trying to move his opponent to a different position, then negligible force probably won’t do it!

 

[Runner Ref]

Theoretically you’re correct. But in reality, the commonly accepted meaning of “push” takes you quickly down a non-negligible route. Push is defined as … to use physical pressure or force, especially with yourhands, in order to move something into a different position, usually one that is further away from you … if a player is trying to move his opponent to a different position, then negligible force probably won’t do it!

Again, I agree with what you’re saying for the most part. But I was pointing out that using phrases as was used above is false and not helpful to anyone.

I was basically told off on here the other week when they tried to misinterpret one of my quotes for something similar.

 

[Purron4]

Yes. But you try telling toon fans that. They won’t have it

Not sure which toon fans you're referring to but myself (a toon fan) and all my mates agree it was a red card.