RefSix

Match control advice

QuaverRef

I used to be indecisive but now i'm not so sure
#1
On the whole, I’ve always been happy with my match control. I’ve never had big incidents on anything boil over to the point of mass confrontations etc but I’m just looking for advice about a game today. 1 red (SFP), 6 yellows and 3 sin bins. The game was tight, ending 2-0 but was full of players tripping, shirt pulling etc which pretty much ended with handbags on every occasion. I attempt speaking to captains, isolating players, slowing down the game where possible but nothing was preventing them from doing it. I started using cards more regularly but that’s where the sin bins came in, with one player even saying ‘I’m handing cards out like sweets, it’s a farce’. That was a quote from the winning team as well.

I know this is realistically YHTBT, but any advice on some techniques for match control would be great. It just got to a stage in the game where I thought ‘sod it, there’s no helping them. Just getting booking!’
 

Grayson

RefChat Addict
#2
They happen, unfortunately. As long as you're happy in your consistency then you've shown them the benchmark and tolerance level, so ball's in their courts really. Sounds like you've tried the quiet word, the captain chat, the stepped approach, then cautions followed. Never great when a referee eases off once he's set the threshold for cautions, looks inconsistent (and control goes right out then). Sounds like you gave them chances and it didn't sink in. Balls to 'em.
 

RobOda

RefChat Addict
#3
‘I’m handing cards out like sweets, it’s a farce’.
Good, do that, it's a compliment IMO. They're shopping for those sweets, so hand them out.

As you say it's YHTBT, I can't speculate to the mood of the match, but to offer a contrarian opinion, perhaps by 'managing' the game you left it too long to start bringing the cards out? I find that sometimes early cautions can make the players switch on an realise they need to tread more carefully, sometimes I think if it is 'managed' and ignored it starts escalating and then players get annoyed they've been cautioned when someone else hasn't for the same offence. For me, tripping offences are something I have a low tolerance for (I'm visualising those trips that aren't attempts at winning the ball), those should be cautioned from the off IMO.

Then again, it's probably very likely you did fine and it's just one of those games where the players were just being uncooperative.
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
#4
I've never had... anything boil over
1 red (SFP), 6 yellows and 3 sin bins
Guess this one was just simmering then :confused:
I think you can have the best MC in the world, but some mass confrontations and disasters spontaneously spawn from nothing.
Not sure I'm in a position to offer advice, but I find the whole 'slowing things down' thing tricky. A bit like incorrectly awarding a CK and then having to 'find a foul' as a get out. Sometimes the opportunity to kill the game doesn't arise without inventing fouls and sanctions. I think the answer might be, 'stay respectful, assertive, clever with the vocals and remain calm (because the players feed of this)'. I'll let you know when I've mastered these things ;)
 

Tealeaf

Lighting the darkest hour
Staff member
#5
The only I can offer is to reiterate a point from contributors above: Would an earlier caution have killed it off? 50/50 outcome - some days it will, and others it’ll be an “occupational hazard” for the recipient.

In a way you sound like you’ve had a similar experience to me last week with my ‘hiding to nothing thread’.
 
#6
Not sure I'm in a position to offer advice, but I find the whole 'slowing things down' thing tricky. A bit like incorrectly awarding a CK and then having to 'find a foul' as a get out. Sometimes the opportunity to kill the game doesn't arise without inventing fouls and sanctions.
I don’t think it is at all like the CK mystery foul.

We all set a bar between trifling and a foul. And a bar between careless and reckless. Slowing things down means recognizing the bar is too high for this game, and brining it down. (Just don’t start the lower fouls bar with a PK or scoring opportunity it’s dfk!) And it can mean being reluctant to apply advantage—if it’s not a really good advantage, just call the foul. Yes, it takes experience to do well, but that doesn’t mean inventing fouls or cautions (if you have to invent them, the game is probably under control). But some games all the best ref techniques aren’t going to solve the problems the players create—we can only do so much to save players from themselves.
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
#7
I don’t think it is at all like the CK mystery foul.

We all set a bar between trifling and a foul. And a bar between careless and reckless. Slowing things down means recognizing the bar is too high for this game, and brining it down. (Just don’t start the lower fouls bar with a PK or scoring opportunity it’s dfk!) And it can mean being reluctant to apply advantage—if it’s not a really good advantage, just call the foul. Yes, it takes experience to do well, but that doesn’t mean inventing fouls or cautions (if you have to invent them, the game is probably under control). But some games all the best ref techniques aren’t going to solve the problems the players create—we can only do so much to save players from themselves.
The CK thing was intended as a metaphor. I'm just indicating that lowering the bar can make matters worse, if it causes foul recognition to head south.
Personally, I find it much easier to change yellow card thresholds than i do to tweak careless foul tackle tolerance
 
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Justylove

RefChat Addict
#8
Sometimes you have to reflect and acknowledge that it’s “them, not me”
Sin bins are a great example, most of the time it has the right effect on players, once you’ve used it. They all realise that they need to calm down and not risk it. However I had one team where it had no effect whatsoever and I ended up having 3 of them in sin bin. Looking back, I didn’t think I could have done anything differently that would have changed the situation (other than ignoring the blatant dissent being dished up).
 
#9
The CK thing was intended as a metaphor. I'm just indicating that lowering the bar can make matters worse, if it causes foul recognition to head south.
Personally, I find it much easier to change yellow card thresholds than i do to tweak careless foul tackle tolerance
I’d humbly suggest that developing the skill to move the foul threshold is critical to reading games and being effective. I agree it’s not easy (and that it’s easier to loosen the reins than to tighten them). But IMHO, sometimes it is the only tool that is going to help a particular game.
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
#10
I’d humbly suggest that developing the skill to move the foul threshold is critical to reading games and being effective. I agree it’s not easy (and that it’s easier to loosen the reins than to tighten them). But IMHO, sometimes it is the only tool that is going to help a particular game.
We're not in disagreement. Quite the opposite really. I'm three years in and need games in which I can practice this stuff. I had one yesterday which turned out OK, but I need more exposure (on the horizon, I'm sure)
 

Justylove

RefChat Addict
#11
I’d humbly suggest that developing the skill to move the foul threshold is critical to reading games and being effective. I agree it’s not easy (and that it’s easier to loosen the reins than to tighten them). But IMHO, sometimes it is the only tool that is going to help a particular game.
That is true, however sometimes it matters not what you as the referee do, the players just don’t respond positively to it.
 
#12
Something in the water I think. 1 game yesterday with 4 sin bins, 2 yellows and 1 red, all for 1 team. They just couldn’t keep their mouths shut. The sin bins made them worse, their opponents twigged what my tolerance level was and stayed respectful. Then today another game, 4 sin bins again, 2 apiece, 1 yellow card each and 3 reds, 2 1. One player told me I should go ref kids after awarding a stone wall penalty, another said as long as you get the ball you can take the player out after. I found both games emotionally draining and challenging and have reflected on what I could’ve done differently. It’s natural to think as a referee that you’re at fault for players attitudes and actions, but truth is, when you’re consistent and apply the laws of the game, it’s all down to the players not you.
 

Nij

Well-Known Member
#13
Something in the water I think. 1 game yesterday with 4 sin bins, 2 yellows and 1 red, all for 1 team. They just couldn’t keep their mouths shut. The sin bins made them worse, their opponents twigged what my tolerance level was and stayed respectful. Then today another game, 4 sin bins again, 2 apiece, 1 yellow card each and 3 reds, 2 1. One player told me I should go ref kids after awarding a stone wall penalty, another said as long as you get the ball you can take the player out after. I found both games emotionally draining and challenging and have reflected on what I could’ve done differently. It’s natural to think as a referee that you’re at fault for players attitudes and actions, but truth is, when you’re consistent and apply the laws of the game, it’s all down to the players not you.
Emphasis added, because that right there is all you need to think about.
One team adhered to the law and was able to play eleven all the way. One team repeatedly breached the law and was disciplined appropriately. You can only do your role, and hope they do theirs.
 
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