A&H

Bellerin's foul throws

T

Trip

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Level 5 Referee
Video here:

www.planetfootball.com

Watch: Hector Bellerin takes *another* foul throw, Arsenal Twitter erupts - Planet Football

Hector Bellerin's foul throw during Arsenal's 2-0 defeat at Tottenham aptly summarised the Gunners' performance - and their fans have not held back on Twitter.
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Could somebody explain which part of Law 15 he is in breach of?

Atkinson indicates that he's thrown the ball downwards. I know a lot of players think that's a foul throw (I did when I was a player) but I don't understand which part of the laws it breaks.
 
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Most myths are created by referees, not players. Very poor call. It could be a misinterpretation of the recent addition of the word "stand" meaning not kneel etc.

Calls like this don't make our job much easier.
 
I believe its the part of "above the head" however in this clip, that's not a foul throw
 
I thought from the discussion that this was a "spike" down to the ground, but that isn't what this was (and we could debate whether a spike is truly a foul throw). I think the R was trying to signal that the ball didn't come from over his head, but from in front of it. I think that was factually wrong, but not based on a myth. (I wonder if this is something they were watching for because the player's had an issue with it before, and then saw something that wasn't there. I wasn't sure if Atkinson was saying it was his call or that it was not his call and was flagged by the AR.)
 
That's never, ever, ever remotely close to a foul throw. No wonder we get incessant requests for foul throws throughout our games if players are seeing high profile decisions like this .... :wall:
 
Yeah, nothing wrong with the throw in the link at all! The downside of doing your pre-match research, his reputation has caused this decision more than anything that's actually happened!
 
socal lurker said:
I wasn't sure if Atkinson was saying it was his call or that it was not his call and was flagged by the AR.)
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I can read him saying "not me. It was him" if that is the case and he is meaning I didn't call it, it was the AR who called it, that is poor form. It's throwing the AR under the bus. It is always the referee's call. AR only helps the referee to make that call. This is just as bad as flagging the AR down when he calls it. As a referee if you are going to call the AR's flag then it is also your responsibility to sell it as your own decision.
 
one said:
I can read him saying "not me. It was him" if that is the case and he is meaning I didn't call it, it was the AR who called it, that is poor form. It's throwing the AR under the bus. It is always the referee's call. AR only helps the referee to make that call. This is just as bad as flagging the AR down when he calls it. As a referee if you are going to call the AR's flag then it is also your responsibility to sell it as your own decision.
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I think it's more likely that he's responding to another Arsenal player, complaining about the decision, by saying don't blame me, blame Bellerin ....
 
Russell Jones said:
That's never, ever, ever remotely close to a foul throw. No wonder we get incessant requests for foul throws throughout our games if players are seeing high profile decisions like this .... :wall:
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Correct. (Remember my old thread on this very subject? ;)).

Like @Degnann has already pointed out, the visual effect of this can often stem from the fact that the player hasn't quite "started" the throw from behind his head which of course is a foul throw but I've noticed that players and coaches often seem to interpret this as the "foul throw" decision being based on the notion that the ball has to be released from the hands by a certain point!! :rolleyes: I always try and educate as I go along but as you say, it doesn't help when throws like Bellerin's are seen to be penalised on TV. :wtf:
 
I get some stick from people who see me work quite a bit because I'm relatively lenient on throws. No way am I calling this one a foul throw. If it's a short throw like this, I just want the ball back into play. Yes, if it's a one-handed throw, an underhand roll, etc., I'm calling it. If it's a long thrown and the thrower does it illegally, I'll call it more often.

I see this as similar to the throw where the thrower slides his/her foot just barely off the ground for a five-yard thrown-in. Invariably, I'll get parents screaming for a foul throw. It's trifling - the thrower is getting absolutely no advantage from having his/her foot an inch off the ground. Get the ball in and let's get on with it.
 
Most 'foul throw' calls I get are when the ball is released when it's moving downwards. When I point out that there's nothing in the law to say you have to release the ball by a certain point the first question is "so you can literally throw the ball straight down?"

And the answer is ... yes? Unfortunately say this instantly damages your credibility because it's so ingrained.
 
RefIADad said:
I get some stick from people who see me work quite a bit because I'm relatively lenient on throws. No way am I calling this one a foul throw. If it's a short throw like this, I just want the ball back into play. Yes, if it's a one-handed throw, an underhand roll, etc., I'm calling it. If it's a long thrown and the thrower does it illegally, I'll call it more often.

I see this as similar to the throw where the thrower slides his/her foot just barely off the ground for a five-yard thrown-in. Invariably, I'll get parents screaming for a foul throw. It's trifling - the thrower is getting absolutely no advantage from having his/her foot an inch off the ground. Get the ball in and let's get on with it.
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I'm also very lenient on foul throws unless its ridiculously bad. I remember doing an u15 academy game in the middle last year and one of the ARs who was relatively new to officiating was giving foul throws unless it looked perfect (despite pre match instructions). It was clewr from his flag technique that he was very new to officiating so I walked over to him during an injury break and told him to not flag for foul throws and that I'd clarify at HT. 10 mins later, the ball is thrown in and he flags then instantly realises he forgot that I asked him not to flag and put it down quickly and shouted sorry. I had to give it then as everyone stopped.

Morale of the story for me is unless its ridiculously bad or creates a big advantage ie long throw with one leg in the air then play on
 
Trip said:
Most 'foul throw' calls I get are when the ball is released when it's moving downwards. When I point out that there's nothing in the law to say you have to release the ball by a certain point the first question is "so you can literally throw the ball straight down?"

And the answer is ... yes? Unfortunately say this instantly damages your credibility because it's so ingrained.
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It’s a bit like the “he can’t say leave it, ref!” situation. But don’t get me started on that!
 
The problem is clearly Martin Atkinson making it up as he goes along. 🙄
He did the same to Deandre Yedlin playing for Sunderland against Newcastle a couple of years back - I even posted a thread about it....
 
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