A&H

Advice on handling interactions with players

G

gvu_ref

Member
Hi, new ref here. I’ve got a handful of games under my belt now, age range between 10s-14s.

Had a few games now where my decisions have been questioned. Penalties for clumsy fouls in the box mainly (had to give 2 tonight so it’s fresh in my mind), player charging in from behind claiming “shoulder”, clumsy trailing foot trip etc etc. And I feel as though blowing for a penailty is the correct decision, it’s simply a foul in the box, I wouldn’t be doing my job if I just “let it go”.

when you get grief back from players in that scenario, I’m a bit stumped how to handle it best. Usually for a foul anywhere else on the pitch, I will reply with a quick explanation ie “he’s caught him on the ankle” and then move to my next position, me literally moving away from the player ends the interaction. But for a penalty you have to remain near the players and they are going on and on moaning about the decision, I’m wondering if anyone has any good phrases to basically shut them up. I don’t want to patronise them, it’s grass roots, they’re here to have fun and play ball, I want educate and ref their game the best I can. but at the same time, I’m not here to justify myself and what I’ve seen 5 times to a 14 year old.

Ive figured out how to shut the coaches up screaming at me “OFFSIDE!” every five minutes even though their defenders are not holding a line, I’m using “I’m reffing what I see, play to the whistle”. At this level I don’t have the luxury of assistants, so I know sometimes I will miss the odd offside, but I’m not getting into the habit of “trusting” a coach to call the line. Basically incase they’re wrong, or cheat, or I get accused of bias.

just wondered if anyone has experienced similar when they’re first starting out and have any good phrases or actions to take to almost cull the conversation with players ASAP so you can just get on with the game.

any help appreciated. I’m thoroughly enjoying it so far.
 
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I think your quick description answer can be effective and you can do the same on a PK. From there move to managing the PK. "White, I need a kicker." "Red, outside the Area, please." A gentle stop sign with the hand and "that's enough, we're moving on" can send the message to the player that you're getting close to the yellow card stage.

But I don't think there are any magic phrases to shut up teenagers--if I found one, I'd be rich from selling it to parents and teachers! Sometimes, teenagers just have to do their thing, and sometimes that means we just have to show them yellow pieces of plastic.
 
In reality you don't have to hang around. Blow your whistle, point to the spot and move to the goal line facing play.
If players approach you, move backwards away from them towards the touch line only returning to monitor the penalty once things have calmed. Use open palsm to indicate to players to remain/move away. And also set a boundary that players can't cross, and if they do, use discipline tools to deal.
If they follow you, encroach beyond a boundary you have set you're looking at an easy dissent caution/sin bin if you use them.
 
Teenagers probably the hardest audience. Few of them will really pay attention to what you say.

I use little catch alls like: “basic foul, easy decision for me guys”, “for me it’s in the back not shoulder to shoulder”, “it’s just not enough for a foul”.

I also treat the 13+ the same as adults, same chats, same attitude, same respect. I try to let the problem players know I am there. And sometimes I give little compliments “good work”, “good idea” but to both sides evenly.

In all this you develop your own style.

In tough games you can’t micro manage everything so you have to pick and choose when to make a connection with a player.

And it varies so much on the level. In elite youth football you don’t have to justify or check all the time - but in slower/lower games, after a hard challenge, it’s well worth firstly “good tackle for me, clean” and then a little later checking on the other player “alright, fair for me”.

But we are all different. I am getting good results with this attentive positive stuff - but I also don’t stand any BS. ;)
 
JamesL said:
In reality you don't have to hang around. Blow your whistle, point to the spot and move to the goal line facing play.
If players approach you, move backwards away from them towards the touch line only returning to monitor the penalty once things have calmed. Use open palsm to indicate to players to remain/move away. And also set a boundary that players can't cross, and if they do, use discipline tools to deal.
If they follow you, encroach beyond a boundary you have set you're looking at an easy dissent caution/sin bin if you use them.
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Totally.

Moving backwards with all players in view is key at pens and some other situations. It makes it so much easier to identify the raging dissent players and prepare your card strategy and cards.

I had one the other week. The two players protesting the pen just happened to be a top flight assistant and 2nd tier ref. I did the back peddling towards the corner. By the time they got to me, flailing, they were walking into the yellow;) They kindly said after the pen, goal and cards were correct. Phew!
 
James is spot on, literally

Ye olde time practise of giving pk then moving to goal line
today, we see on tv refs pointing to, to standing at the spot, in the melee

If i give one which is absolutely nailed on, no, I dont always go to goal line, I happy to gamble dissent be minimal but yes those ones you reckon will cause some protest, give it confidently ,and subject to not having to deal witn confrontation, get away, facing the players, making any of them who come after you responsible for their own fate, anyone shouting anything untoward has dug their own grave and hopefully their comments have been loud and clear so easily sold as sanction, anyone getting in close is mobbing you, has come after you, and again, its clearly sold if you decide to take action. Moving that bit away buys time for you and the players too.

Communication is vital but not every decision need be met with explaination
Sometimes less is more, you having been in a credible position, confidently blowing whistle and pointing to spot should be sign enough to anyone that you have awarded a pk.
why? ask the players

because thats a foul
because thats handball

no need to go into forensic analysis, esp when you or the players wont get to see it again to back up your claims.
 
Once at the goal-line, consider speaking to the one player who talks sense... not usually/always the Captain. Beckoning that one player towards you yields much better results in terms of pushing the hoard of players away. Works for me
The hoard backs off because they feel their voice is being represented by the one player you've chosen. The one that is very unlikely to result in a C2
 
I think James hit the nail on the head there with regards to positioning, movement and boundaries.

The advice I've got through assessments over the last few years has always been 'don't be there' and 'don't get involved', literally don't get into explaining your decisions because you'll be at it all day and some savvy players will chip away at you and twist your words against you and get under your skin.

Just give the foul, utilise your movement and be ready to punish any player that persistently comes at you.

I've found that players generally wise up rather quickly, when they realise you won't get engaged in these discussions they'll stop pursuing you, and those that don't tend to go into the book and that ends the matter rather quickly.

That doesn't mean I won't be approachable on the field though. I will chat with players, have some banter and be very verbal i.e; when I say 'no foul' etc etc, and that's fine, but by not tolerating any questions when giving a foul, that draws a fairly clear line in the sand and most players will get on with it.
 
santa sangria said:
I use little catch alls like: “basic foul, easy decision for me guys”, “for me it’s in the back not shoulder to shoulder”, “it’s just not enough for a foul”.
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Good advise - a quick, succinct explanation then get on with the game.
 
Thanks all, some good tips here that I can take on board and try and use. I like the walking backwards from the players and them walking into a yellow card, then it’s clear for all to see on the touch line too what’s happening and where I draw the line for a caution. Also “because that’s a foul” “basic foul in the back”, so simple, will use these. Short and sweet will hopefully deter “debate”.

found myself last night wanting to say “please just be quiet” or “number 10 give it a rest” but didn’t want to become that patronising ref … I think “that’s enough” will work well, and “easy decision for me”.

I guess I need to remember there is also an element of, they are teenagers, and this is how some will behave.

thanks all for the comments, reffing is quite a lonely experience sometimes so it’s great to have a little place like this to find some comfort after getting a bit of stick from a tough crowd.
 
Yep it's ok to give a very quick explanation of what and why, but don't let it descend into a discussion. You can head those situations off with comments like:

"You've asked, I've told you, we're not having a discussion about it, we're getting on with the game"

If the player then carries on you can escalate through the stepped approach:

"Yes please player. Right, I've told you what the reason is, you may not agree, but you now have a choice, you can either stop and we'll get on with the game or you can carry on and you'll be having a sit down for <x> minutes"

You've then got complete control of the situation with the player.
 
Pretty much what everyone else has said.

Move away (while keeping the field of play in view).

Personally, once I’ve reached the goal line I’ll make a final appeal along the line of “guys I’m not going to change my mind, move away please” then I’ll make a show of getting my book out, which normally gets people moving, after that I start taking names.
 
A lot of fairly sound advice on here from guys that know. Just my tuppence worth though ...

Don't worry about "patronising" the players mate. At the end of the day, a lot of the problems associated with players abusing and disrespecting the referee stem from the fact that football referees appear to have been culturally "dehumanised" by players, coaches and spectators alike. In the situations you describe, don't encourage that or pander to their feelings cos' they sure as hell ain't worried about yours when they start questioning your decision especially if it's in a "confrontational" manner.

You can go a long way to reminding them that you're a human being with feelings and emotions just like them, by saying something like "Okay gents/ladies, I've had enough now. It's a foul in the area, therefore it's a penalty. I've given the decision, let it go now before the Sin Bin starts!!" (You then have to stick to your word of course). I don't know how old you are or what you look like, so you may or may not have the appearance and bearing to confidently adopt that approach but all I'll say is it works for me. ;)
 
Lots of good advice here. I do think part of this is finding an approach that works for you individually. You need to be comfortable doing it and it needs to come across as authentic, not manufactured. Something that sounds like you are just reading from a script somebody taught you on a training course winds people up. For what it's worth. a couple things I have found that work for me :

1. Whatever your approach, never get into a long debate. Explain, acknowledge difference of opinion if appropriate, and move on. Have a couple of stock phrases up your sleeve to end the discussion. I often use something like 'I've explained what I've seen, you had a different view, that's fine but we're getting on with it now'. Then do something positive physically and verbally and don't wait for the player to fill the space. I'm usually moving away at some pace and saying 'goal kick when you are ready keeper please' or whatever is appropriate. The player has then got to be doing something blatant and obvious to continue it and I have the benefit of not having to hear any mutterings - being out of earshot can sometimes be useful

2. I distinguish between decisions I am 100% sure about and decisions where there is a grey area - and there are lots of those in football. I don't try to sell one of the latter as the former. If it's nailed on, I'm saying that. Otherwise, something like 'From my angle, he's taken the ball cleanly, and to be fair I had a good view of it' lowers the temperature a bit. Doesn't say 'I'm right, you're wrong' and acknowledges the possibility of another viewpoint without undermining your decision
 
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that’s a really great one actually I hadn’t thought of “from my angle that’s a foul/penalty/good challenge” etc . I do my best to try and keep up with play as my mentor has instilled in me “the closer you are to it, the more credibility it gives your decision”… sometimes you get the coaches screaming from the side “REF HOWS THAT A FOUL??” Which motivates their players to kick up a fuss too. But if I use that phrase “from my angle that’s a foul” I will be able to manage the players and situation on pitch and nip it in the bud.
Thankyou again for all the great contributions and input on this thread. I totally agree with avoiding the “I’m right your wrong” approach because my experience as a player tells me all that does is wind up the players on the pitch and they’ll get petty and give you a hard time for it for the rest of the game.
I’ve got a few games at the weekend so will try the phrases out if I need to!
 
gvu_ref said:
sometimes you get the coaches screaming from the side “REF HOWS THAT A FOUL??” Which motivates their players to kick up a fuss too. But if I use that phrase “from my angle that’s a foul” I will be able to manage the players and situation on pitch and nip it in the bud.
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Do whatever you think is gonna work best mate. Just remember though, when a coach/player says to you "Ref, how is that a foul", 99.9% of the time he doesn't actually want to hear your explanation, he simply wants to give you his opinion and disagree further with yours. If you're up for trying to placate that then expect little/nothing to change ... ;)
 
Interesting technique I saw once when I was watching a game was the ref answering by asking the coach “why do you think it is/isn’t a foul?”. Not one I’ve ever used but seemed to work for him.
 
LothianRef said:
Interesting technique I saw once when I was watching a game was the ref answering by asking the coach “why do you think it is/isn’t a foul?”. Not one I’ve ever used but seemed to work for him.
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I've used "what did you see" with coaches. Makes them articulate instead of just yell. And then gives me the chance to say, "OK, thanks, here's what I saw." (And I don't say "from 30 yards closer and a better angle . . . ." --I save those kind of comments for when I'm an AR and talking about the R . . .)
 
Kes said:
Do whatever you think is gonna work best mate. Just remember though, when a coach/player says to you "Ref, how is that a foul", 99.9% of the time he doesn't actually want to hear your explanation, he simply wants to give you his opinion and disagree further with yours. If you're up for trying to placate that then expect little/nothing to change ... ;)
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I experience this first hand nearly every match and it couldn't be more true. My threshold for engaging with the managers is very high, unless they have gotten personal, stepped onto the FOP or are yelling so aggressively that it can't go unpunished then I am not talking to them and as Kes says they are just stating their opinion and aren't actually expecting you to reply anyway. Plus I've got 22 players on the pitch to manage!

Watch your favourite team on TV, at some point you are going to yell "How is that a foul!?", you aren't expecting a response though, it's just you stating your opinion rhetorically.
 
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