A&H

Advantage and offside

Philzo

New Member
Level 7 Referee
Hi all,

Wondering if I can pick your brains on this one.

Team A were in the attacking half and their player on the ball was fouled but there was a good opportunity for an advantage so I waved play-on. Another Team A player tried to play a long ball but didn’t find their man at all.

I went back to the free-kick as no advantage was played.

At HT Team B’s coach - who wasn’t rude but merely pointed out - the advantage was played to a player who was offside and therefore the advantage was over.

Despite the ball was nowhere near the offside player in question it got me thinking...is he right if I wave advantage and the following ball finds Team A in an offside position I therefore give the indirect FK for offside?

My mind has gone completely blank...
 
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So here is how it should work. The team should be in a better position compared to a free kick (benefits is the word used in law) for you to play advantage. If you are not sure, you wait a few seconds to see. So if you played advantage that means they were in a better position, if they stuffed up after that, then its their fault and by bringing the ball back you are giving them two bites at the cherry.

In other words, playing advantage doesn't mean you are waiting to see if they are better off, it means they are already better off.
 
@one is correct. So to apply that logic to your situation, which is better for team A - a FK in your own half for the foul, or a FK against you in the opponent's half for the offside? I would argue the team would prefer the FK in their own half, so I would be going back for that (assuming we're talking about to events separated by a few seconds and no more).
 
For me, you wait a few seconds until the advantage is there and only then shout advantage and signal. Some referees shout it straight away and signal, only to come back to it when they lose the ball.

Foul comes in, whistle to mouth, give it a few seconds, see the flag go up, blow for the foul - "No opportunity for advantage".
 
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Just going back to OP, you are applying a rugby advantage concept to football. There is no such thing in football as advantage over. You either play advantage or you don't. There is only one signal and one decision and you have a few seconds to make that decision. Make full use of the few seconds if you need to but once you make that signal (in your case wave "play on") it's done and over with, there is no going back.
 
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the advantage was played to a player who was offside

What do you mean?

Please explain your scenario again and explain the timing of the foul, and the player being in an offside position, and the player becoming active... if that's what happened?
 
Curious, because when I did the referee course, we did a drill in which we would either stop play for a free kick, or play advantage by immediately calling 'advantage' with arms outstretched. I don't think the drill was very good in hindsight
I know the advantage must not result in two bites of the cherry, but i hadn't thought of the advantage signal as the threshold for when play can't be called back
 
but i hadn't thought of the advantage signal as the threshold for when play can't be called back
I hadn't either until not long ago but it makes things so much tidier. If I've given the signal, it's because there IS an advantage and I'm not going back, not just there might be one...
 
The application of advantage depends on your level of football.

In England, for levels 4 and below, we are encouraging the swift signalling of advantage. Do this as you would blow the whistle. A prompt call ensures that players know you have seen the offence (reducing the potential for afters). Additionally, players realise they have chance to benefit for a few seconds. If they lose control or another tackle comes in, then go back and award the free kick.

Above L4, a late signal is expected, once the advantage has been applied. The players are better and less likely to settle with afters.
 
From the OP, I’d be pulling that back. The only time I wouldn’t pull the play back is for a poor pass which goes out of play or is overhit etc (not if it’s intercepted). I feel that’s their own advantage ruined through poor play, if I pull that back for the foul, I’m basically just giving them a second chance to make up for their mistake
 
The application of advantage depends on your level of football.

In England, for levels 4 and below, we are encouraging the swift signalling of advantage. Do this as you would blow the whistle. A prompt call ensures that players know you have seen the offence (reducing the potential for afters). Additionally, players realise they have chance to benefit for a few seconds. If they lose control or another tackle comes in, then go back and award the free kick.

Above L4, a late signal is expected, once the advantage has been applied. The players are better and less likely to settle with afters.

Doesn’t Level 2B - 4 have the same criteria in the observer handbook? Where is the guidance saying that advantage should be applied differently at level 4.
Step 5 can be L4 or L3.
 
The application of advantage depends on your level of football.

In England, for levels 4 and below, we are encouraging the swift signalling of advantage. Do this as you would blow the whistle. A prompt call ensures that players know you have seen the offence (reducing the potential for afters). Additionally, players realise they have chance to benefit for a few seconds. If they lose control or another tackle comes in, then go back and award the free kick.

Above L4, a late signal is expected, once the advantage has been applied. The players are better and less likely to settle with afters.
This makes a lot more sense than the slightly mixed guidance I've been given over various assessments. Different rules for different levels at least makes sense, it's just a shame that can't be more clearly communicated.
 
Doesn’t Level 2B - 4 have the same criteria in the observer handbook? Where is the guidance saying that advantage should be applied differently at level 4.
Step 5 can be L4 or L3.
Our L4 are at step 7, I know others league are different. At our level of football, this is the expectations of the players, so your refereeing style should change.

If the L4 was at step 5, then of course, use the different expectation. The observers guide is to appropriately signalled.

This policy seems to be understood by the referees and the players at our step 7 league.
 
So here is how it should work. The team should be in a better position compared to a free kick (benefits is the word used in law) for you to play advantage. If you are not sure, you wait a few seconds to see. So if you played advantage that means they were in a better position, if they stuffed up after that, then its their fault and by bringing the ball back you are giving them two bites at the cherry.

In other words, playing advantage doesn't mean you are waiting to see if they are better off, it means they are already better off.

Good reply and I hope you don't mind me raising a query :)

How would you know whether they are already better off unless you let it run for a few more seconds ? I agree, if they mess up the pass or someone has strayed offside, that's their fault and they shouldn't have two bites of the cherry. But wouldn't it make sense to just let the game run for a little before deciding to throw your arms out and screaming "Advantage, play on"

I think it sets the tempo for the whole game. If defenders see that we're going to make quick decisions without letting the game run, they'll deliberately make fouls to disrupt their opponents rhythm. Once they see we're prepared to let the game run, they tend to commit less fouls as they don't want to go to ground so easily.
 
Good reply and I hope you don't mind me raising a query :)

How would you know whether they are already better off unless you let it run for a few more seconds ? I agree, if they mess up the pass or someone has strayed offside, that's their fault and they shouldn't have two bites of the cherry. But wouldn't it make sense to just let the game run for a little before deciding to throw your arms out and screaming "Advantage, play on"

I think it sets the tempo for the whole game. If defenders see that we're going to make quick decisions without letting the game run, they'll deliberately make fouls to disrupt their opponents rhythm. Once they see we're prepared to let the game run, they tend to commit less fouls as they don't want to go to ground so easily.

I agree. An often occurrence for me is players being pushed when jumping to head the ball. If they are pushed and still win the flick on, I’ll wait to see what happens when it drops before either giving the foul or playing advantage
 
I frequently delay a second or two deciding on marginal fouls, so indicating advantage after a pause works nicely for me. I realise that more significant fouls need a prompt whistle in the absence of an obvious reason to play on
 
Good reply and I hope you don't mind me raising a query :)

How would you know whether they are already better off unless you let it run for a few more seconds ? I agree, if they mess up the pass or someone has strayed offside, that's their fault and they shouldn't have two bites of the cherry. But wouldn't it make sense to just let the game run for a little before deciding to throw your arms out and screaming "Advantage, play on"

I think it sets the tempo for the whole game. If defenders see that we're going to make quick decisions without letting the game run, they'll deliberately make fouls to disrupt their opponents rhythm. Once they see we're prepared to let the game run, they tend to commit less fouls as they don't want to go to ground so easily.
Absolutely. And that's the way I meant it. The first part of my post explains it that way. Perhaps I should have said "it should mean they are already better off". So if they are not already better of, delay your signal. But if you don't need the few seconds though and waiting the few seconds it can backfire if the attackers don't use the advantageous opportunity they have.

But that may be a moot point as they are taught differently in England (which I don't agree with BTW but I can see the reason).
 
ADVANTAGE = OPPORTUNITY + POSSESSION
Say the ball carrier is running with the bool, looking to push the ball forwards, and is fouled. He then recovers his feet and the ball.

How's his position compared to before he was fouled?

If he still has just as good an opportunity as before to send it to an onside player, there's no real change between who's onside and offside, but he sents it to an offside player, then it's on him. Same as a bad pass.

If, however, the player he was looking to pass it to was onside at the time of foul and offside by the time the ball was played, then the attacking team is still being disadvantaged by the foul, because the opportunities aren't there.
 
I have always found the way we are taught the advantage at a low level of refereeing quite confusing.

I always tell the captains I will play it where possible so to expect that delay. Also as well I try to say to the offended "seen the foul, can we play" he knows I've seen it and so does everyone else. If they progress its "play on advantage" and no coming back. I would never shout play on advantage then bring it back
 
I always tell the captains I will play it where possible so to expect that delay.
See, depending on exactly how you mean that, for me it smacks of pushing it too far. I don't think you should play advantage wherever it's possible - you should only play it if there's a true and fairly incontrovertible advantage.

As for how it's taught, I obviously don't know what training you've gone through but I think there's some pretty good advice in the Laws of the Game document, as follows:
The referee may play advantage whenever an offence occurs but should consider the following in deciding whether to apply the advantage or stop play:
• the severity of the offence – if the offence warrants a sending-off, the referee must stop play and send off the player unless there is a clear opportunity to score a goal
• the position where the offence was committed - the closer to the opponent’s goal, the more effective the advantage can be
• the chances of an immediate, promising attack
• the atmosphere of the match

Of all of those, I think the one that's the most often overlooked (but shouldn't be) is, "the chances of an immediate, promising attack." Just having possession is not enough - there must be a real attacking opportunity and one that looks likely to come off. Next most important (for me) is the position on the field.

I see far too many examples when advantage is played even though there really isn't an immediate promising attack in the offing and when the play is too far away from the opponent's goal.
 
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