RefSix

Abuse and Decision Making

#1
I apologise for the length of this post. [EDIT] this perhaps should be in Match Incidents. But as a reasonably new referee (qualified in the summer), I thought I'd post it here.

I have refereed a couple of handfuls of games now (15-20). Most have gone without any major incident. I do the refereeing for one club and most of the players, parents and managers know me quite well. I managed one of the teams for a number of years and stepped down last year.

However the last couple of games have been absolutely awful and I would like some advise about what I should be doing differently. These are U13 and U14 games, not adults. I am a 30 year old adult so can handle most people around the pitch, but we do have a 16 year old who does referee this age group - which concerns me.

First game - U13s;

The game was 0-2 and there were are couple of decisions I made. A key one was one player (away) jumped (barged) into the back of someone, I gave a free kick to the home team. Explained to the child that side to side without being excessive is fine, but not through the back. Parents were not happy with it but let it go. However 5 minutes later the same player (away) was running alongside another player (home, who had the ball), tripped over his own feet and I carried on play. The parents were furious that I didn't give the away team a freekick. I still don't know why they were complaining. The game continued for another couple of minutes and the ball went out for a corner to the home team. One parent in particular was excessively shouting. I paused the game to go and speak to him. At this point there was 4 minutes until full time.

My mistakes - I went over the sideline and asked the spectator to calm down because I am the referee, I make the decisions and he needs to respect everyone on the pitch, not be so angry his face had gone red (I didn't say the latter). He did not shut up. I then asked him to leave the area. He refused. I asked him once again as I could not continue with this abuse and I would abandon the game. He continued, refused to leave. I abandoned the game. The manager spoke to me and asked me to continue the game for the sake of the children. I should have spoken to the manager before speaking to the spectator (mistake one). I agreed to continue the game (mistake two), but would be reporting it. I did report it to the league and the local FA. The game ended 1-2 (the home team scored in those last 4 minutes). The home team were happy with my refereeing.

Second game - U14s

Parents shouting and commenting on some decisions from the other side of the pitch. I ignore. There was then a crunching late tackle by a home player, side on, clipped the ball but took the player first, sliding. I quickly blew my whistle and gave a free kick. I did not give a caution (but should have), I did speak to the player and he apologised straight away. A few away players were then constantly sarcastic towards me, and generally were cursing during the game. I spoke to the linesman (away parent) at half time and said yes it should have been a caution, but I cannot go back and change my mind. He understood this and mentioned that he thinks I am losing control.

A minute into the second half one of the away players then went sliding in, nowhere near taking the ball and going straight for the player. The player was cautioned. His parent was then furious with me. The manager then substituted that player.

I then had another 20 minutes of shouting from the sidelines, sarcasm from away opposition of being biased. At one point I had a parent shout "You are a s*** referee".

Overall, the away team had approximately 15 free kicks, all of them were niggles, a couple of handballs. Nothing malicious or really purposeful, just some players on the home team weren't very good footballers. The home team only had a couple of free-kicks during the game. I did not give the away team a penalty when the ball hit a home players arm (the arm was down by his side and the ball hit him from 5 yards). The law states the handball has to be deliberate so I did not give it. I stand by this decision.

My mistakes - after the game I tried to explain to the players firstly, that yes the first half should have had a caution for the challenge, but that does not mean they can start retaliating and I had to put a stop to it. Some of their players were very nice and said thanks for explaining and parents were nice. Some players complete opposite and continued to be sarcastic. I then went and spoke to the parent who was shouting abuse at me, he did not take kindly to this and said he has been playing football for years and he can say what he likes to me when I am refereeing. I then explained that it an U14s game and this is not the same as an adults, I do not expect swearing from players and I expect all spectators to behave and support everyone on the pitch. Eventually he calmed down and just said that I should learn how to speak to people.


----

So my questions

- Am I right in sticking to my guts from Game 1 and abandoning the game? In future I will obviously speak to the manager first. But should I just accept that parents will be constantly shouting at me? I hadn't really had it before.

- Should I accept U13s and U14s swearing (not necessarily at me) during the game? Personally if that was my child I would not be happy and therefore count it as foul and abusive language. But the Laws of the Game it is a sending off. I am still not sure what to do in this case. If the swearing was directed at me, it would be a straight sending off, but if it's general swearing?

- In the first game I did give a caution for dissent. If a player disagrees with me and says so, I can accept. But this was constant from one player and after I told him he needs to stop, he continued. The caution then came. Do I stamp out ALL chatting back and give cautions? Or do I let them have a small tantrum at a decision. I find it difficult to think what should I just ignore and what should I caution for.

- Is it worth asking the local FA for another more experienced referee to come and mentor me? I am an adult, and refereeing children's games, but the last two games have made me start questioning my ability. I wouldn't say I am aiming to be a Premier League referee, but would look for a promotion or two

- Both games the home team were happy with my performance. But I am not sure if they are just saying this because they know me. They have asked me to referee instead of the younger 16 year old referee they have because he hasn't been as forceful as me on fouling (even though I STILL get shouted at my spectators)

If you managed to get here, thank you very much.
 
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alexgr

RefChat Addict
#2
Well done for the self-reflection - it's the hardest part of being a referee, but without a doubt the most important. Here are my thoughts for what it's worth:

- Am I right in sticking to my guts from Game 1 and abandoning the game? In future I will obviously speak to the manager first. But should I just accept that parents will be constantly shouting at me? I hadn't really had it before.
It depends where your tolerance is really, more often than not I let parents have the odd shout here and there, they know very little about the LOTG so are going to have the odd gripe. If it's getting to the stage where it's either affecting the kids on the pitch or affecting your game, time to get involved. Instead of asking the parent to leave, ask the manager of the team to which said parent belongs to deal with it. You have no authority over the parent, but you do over the manager - if the manager fails to deal with it, threaten abandonment. If they still don't, abandon the match. I see why you went back and restarted the match after abandoning but I think you lose all authority if you do so (they've essentially called your bluff). Make sure you put in a report for the parent.

- Should I accept U13s and U14s swearing (not necessarily at me) during the game? Personally if that was my child I would not be happy and therefore count it as foul and abusive language. But the Laws of the Game it is a sending off. I am still not sure what to do in this case. If the swearing was directed at me, it would be a straight sending off, but if it's general swearing?
There's a fine line I think - even that young, a lot of them will swear out of frustration when they miss a chance. That, I think, is fine, maybe a quick 'watch your language' will do the job. If they're swearing at you, then I think you need to decide whether it's dissent or OFFINABUS. There are some good threads on the forum (and we often disagree!) so it's all about determining what you see fit and coming to a decision. If you're sending off for every swear word, you'd be left with 0 players on the pitch and more trouble than what it's worth but you have to establish your own tolerance level.

- In the first game I did give a caution for dissent. If a player disagrees with me and says so, I can accept. But this was constant from one player and after I told him he needs to stop, he continued. The caution then came. Do I stamp out ALL chatting back and give cautions? Or do I let them have a small tantrum at a decision. I find it difficult to think what should I just ignore and what should I caution for.
The stepped approach is the best way to go here - first have a word with the player, either in passing as you're getting ready for a restart or a public talking to and warn them about their behaviour. The next time they talk back, get the captain or another player who has authority involved and warn them that the next time the player talks back they'll be cautioned. The next time, caution them. Follow through on the three steps and you'll be well on your way to managing it.

- Is it worth asking the local FA for another more experienced referee to come and mentor me? I am an adult, and refereeing children's games, but the last two games have made me start questioning my ability. I wouldn't say I am aiming to be a Premier League referee, but would look for a promotion or two
Absolutely, always a good idea to get someone along to watch - they'll pick up on things you won't even have thought of!

Good luck on your endeavours and let us know how you get on!
 

Zimmyman

Active Member
#3
I had exactly the same yesterday !!! Parents coming onto the pitch ! Players fighting U13s I said I was going to abandon but after talking to the two managers and got them to warn their players that at the next sign of trouble I would abandon !! Probably right in the end as the game finished ok ! I had to send the home CAR off for constant verbal at me ! The home parents were shocking !! I’m afraid that I’ve had 3-4 games like this at this age group and it’s the sign of the times !! We need more support bigger fines for misbehaving clubs and mabey expulsion from the league this might stop the constant abuse we get
Oh and please don’t call them children when the abuse and language they give out is on par with an adult ! A child in kids football is a 7 to 8 year old thes 13 year olds are youths and I was called a bald C—t by a so called child a month ago ! We either stop reffing and they have won or we carry on I’m a much
Older ref than you and I won’t be beaten that’s how it is I’m afraid I to like you question my ability !!! But straight after the 13s game I did a 14 s game without one foul in the match and was praised by parents and managers alike si
I know I’m ok !! We will make mistakes we are not premier league refs !! (Even they get it wrong ) stick in there
 

OIREF!

RefChat Addict
#4
I think you have handled things well and the fact that you are reflecting upon these matches is a good position.

One point touched upon by yourself and previous replies is that it is best never to approach a spectator directly - always go through the coaches or manager and ask them to deal with it.
 

Ciley Myrus

RefChat Addict
#5
I dont think the abuse etc is getting worse, I find its always been there but my tolerance of it now is much less, my attitude, for right or wrong, is, wait a minute, am not putting up with that, whereas in years gone by, I have been like, its only words, get on with the game.
A lot of this from my point of view mirrors society I think, the street, the pub, the workplace, hardy anything is acceptable now, so I do have notion that wait a moment, this is not acceptable in the workplace, therefore its not acceptable here. This of course does not apply to every single shout I get, however, for some reason it seems to affect me more now than it did before.
There is certainly an attitude out there that because you have pulled on the black jersey, you are now fair game for anything. Years of inaction by authorities and probably even from our peers have led to this, its so far engrained into society now that I cant ever see it changing.

back to the OP, as you correctly reflect, the first port of call for an unruly parent is the listed team officials,
Abandonment is sadly sometimes the only course of action.
Its not the same but, consider something like, the postman. if your dog bites him that's it, all bets are off and you are no longer getting mail delivered, you need to redirect it or go collect it etc.
Cause hassle on a train and your barred from using it.
Piss around with the take away delivery on the phone or play silly buggers with the taxi firm and your barred.
Shout all manner of things at a football referee? 1 game ban and see you in a fortnight.

Back again to the OP, yes, as someone else pointed out, swearing as such is not an offence, as much or little as we might not appreciate hearing it.

Leagues etc are stuck, they need teams in their league for the league to continue so they cant unless its exceptional, bar teams, they also cant fine them too much as that drains the money from the team who could find themselves unable to continue, thus the league lose a team. Its a vicious cycle.
Leagues lose teams, games dont need covered, less refs are needed, "we" lose out on games.
There is no cheap fix. the baddest of the bad can be expelled sine die, anyone else can return sometime soon to start the cycle all over again.

I guess all you can hope for is a perspective, or play the % game, if you do 10 games, 1 might go pear shape, 2 max, and we move on.
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
#6
I apologise for the length of this post. [EDIT] this perhaps should be in Match Incidents. But as a reasonably new referee (qualified in the summer), I thought I'd post it here.

I have refereed a couple of handfuls of games now (15-20). Most have gone without any major incident. I do the refereeing for one club and most of the players, parents and managers know me quite well. I managed one of the teams for a number of years and stepped down last year.

However the last couple of games have been absolutely awful and I would like some advise about what I should be doing differently. These are U13 and U14 games, not adults. I am a 30 year old adult so can handle most people around the pitch, but we do have a 16 year old who does referee this age group - which concerns me.

First game - U13s;

The game was 0-2 and there were are couple of decisions I made. A key one was one player (away) jumped (barged) into the back of someone, I gave a free kick to the home team. Explained to the child that side to side without being excessive is fine, but not through the back. Parents were not happy with it but let it go. However 5 minutes later the same player (away) was running alongside another player (home, who had the ball), tripped over his own feet and I carried on play. The parents were furious that I didn't give the away team a freekick. I still don't know why they were complaining. The game continued for another couple of minutes and the ball went out for a corner to the home team. One parent in particular was excessively shouting. I paused the game to go and speak to him. At this point there was 4 minutes until full time.

My mistakes - I went over the sideline and asked the spectator to calm down because I am the referee, I make the decisions and he needs to respect everyone on the pitch, not be so angry his face had gone red (I didn't say the latter). He did not shut up. I then asked him to leave the area. He refused. I asked him once again as I could not continue with this abuse and I would abandon the game. He continued, refused to leave. I abandoned the game. The manager spoke to me and asked me to continue the game for the sake of the children. I should have spoken to the manager before speaking to the spectator (mistake one). I agreed to continue the game (mistake two), but would be reporting it. I did report it to the league and the local FA. The game ended 1-2 (the home team scored in those last 4 minutes). The home team were happy with my refereeing.

Second game - U14s

Parents shouting and commenting on some decisions from the other side of the pitch. I ignore. There was then a crunching late tackle by a home player, side on, clipped the ball but took the player first, sliding. I quickly blew my whistle and gave a free kick. I did not give a caution (but should have), I did speak to the player and he apologised straight away. A few away players were then constantly sarcastic towards me, and generally were cursing during the game. I spoke to the linesman (away parent) at half time and said yes it should have been a caution, but I cannot go back and change my mind. He understood this and mentioned that he thinks I am losing control.

A minute into the second half one of the away players then went sliding in, nowhere near taking the ball and going straight for the player. The player was cautioned. His parent was then furious with me. The manager then substituted that player.

I then had another 20 minutes of shouting from the sidelines, sarcasm from away opposition of being biased. At one point I had a parent shout "You are a s*** referee".

Overall, the away team had approximately 15 free kicks, all of them were niggles, a couple of handballs. Nothing malicious or really purposeful, just some players on the home team weren't very good footballers. The home team only had a couple of free-kicks during the game. I did not give the away team a penalty when the ball hit a home players arm (the arm was down by his side and the ball hit him from 5 yards). The law states the handball has to be deliberate so I did not give it. I stand by this decision.

My mistakes - after the game I tried to explain to the players firstly, that yes the first half should have had a caution for the challenge, but that does not mean they can start retaliating and I had to put a stop to it. Some of their players were very nice and said thanks for explaining and parents were nice. Some players complete opposite and continued to be sarcastic. I then went and spoke to the parent who was shouting abuse at me, he did not take kindly to this and said he has been playing football for years and he can say what he likes to me when I am refereeing. I then explained that it an U14s game and this is not the same as an adults, I do not expect swearing from players and I expect all spectators to behave and support everyone on the pitch. Eventually he calmed down and just said that I should learn how to speak to people.


----

So my questions

- Am I right in sticking to my guts from Game 1 and abandoning the game? In future I will obviously speak to the manager first. But should I just accept that parents will be constantly shouting at me? I hadn't really had it before.

- Should I accept U13s and U14s swearing (not necessarily at me) during the game? Personally if that was my child I would not be happy and therefore count it as foul and abusive language. But the Laws of the Game it is a sending off. I am still not sure what to do in this case. If the swearing was directed at me, it would be a straight sending off, but if it's general swearing?

- In the first game I did give a caution for dissent. If a player disagrees with me and says so, I can accept. But this was constant from one player and after I told him he needs to stop, he continued. The caution then came. Do I stamp out ALL chatting back and give cautions? Or do I let them have a small tantrum at a decision. I find it difficult to think what should I just ignore and what should I caution for.

- Is it worth asking the local FA for another more experienced referee to come and mentor me? I am an adult, and refereeing children's games, but the last two games have made me start questioning my ability. I wouldn't say I am aiming to be a Premier League referee, but would look for a promotion or two

- Both games the home team were happy with my performance. But I am not sure if they are just saying this because they know me. They have asked me to referee instead of the younger 16 year old referee they have because he hasn't been as forceful as me on fouling (even though I STILL get shouted at my spectators)

If you managed to get here, thank you very much.
If you're questioning your own ability, mentoring or an observation would be a very good idea. You tend to sense instinctively if there's something wrong with your overall match control and you're expressing some doubts in this respect
Overall, I would avoid speaking to confrontational parents until it becomes a Safeguarding issue. Even then, it's the delegate's responsibility to deal with these people. Don't get drawn into conversational squabbling with anyone during the game. Think of ways to keep communications assertive and brief and deflect some of the work onto the Delegates
 

RobOda

RefChat Addict
#7
Just my personal view/way of dealing with things (not saying it's right/wrong), and I think everyone deals with these in their own way but for me:

- Am I right in sticking to my guts from Game 1 and abandoning the game? In future I will obviously speak to the manager first. But should I just accept that parents will be constantly shouting at me? I hadn't really had it before.
In my view, you shouldn't be getting distracted by the spectators/parents. The only thing I'm concerned about on the pitch are the players and team officials. I'd only be concerned about the spectators/parents if it became a safety issue or they start encroaching the pitch. And if that becomes the case, I'd talk to the home officials to sort it out, and if need be stop the match or abandon it if the issue persists.

If you tune it out now, it'll be a useful talent for when you're running the line one day!

- Should I accept U13s and U14s swearing (not necessarily at me) during the game? Personally if that was my child I would not be happy and therefore count it as foul and abusive language. But the Laws of the Game it is a sending off. I am still not sure what to do in this case. If the swearing was directed at me, it would be a straight sending off, but if it's general swearing?
You're not really there to be the moral guardian on that sort of thing, sure they're kids but they're not yours and I'd treat them as you would an adult. I would leave general swearing well-alone. Even for OFFINABUS if the swearing is just 'Oh for effs sake, I took the effing ball' that isn't enough for a red for me, I personally feel it has to be more than that. You'll have to adjust your own tolerance levels to match the game though, you don't want to be too low a tolerance that you're looking at sending everyone off for effing and blinding.

- In the first game I did give a caution for dissent. If a player disagrees with me and says so, I can accept. But this was constant from one player and after I told him he needs to stop, he continued. The caution then came. Do I stamp out ALL chatting back and give cautions? Or do I let them have a small tantrum at a decision. I find it difficult to think what should I just ignore and what should I caution for.
Multiple ways to deal with that; Some referees like to have a chat/ticking off and finds that works for them. I see the stepped approach has already been mentioned. I've tried those method and found it doesn't work for me personally, I'm probably not very good at chatting with players. I have more success bringing out the caution immediately once a player starts lipping off and I find usually teams get the message rather quickly by the second caution for that offence.

But, there's multiple things for you to consider before-hand. The player's body language, the manner of their expressing their disagreement, the mood and behaviour in general of the match etc. I'm quicker to caution a player if they're aggressive and the match is a bit tetchy, than I am with a player who genuinely asks a question and is polite in disagreeing and the match is being played in good spirits.

So, I guess, I'd say be flexible on this one but once you set your line for a particular match, stay with that line so that you don't come across as inconsistent.

- Is it worth asking the local FA for another more experienced referee to come and mentor me? I am an adult, and refereeing children's games, but the last two games have made me start questioning my ability. I wouldn't say I am aiming to be a Premier League referee, but would look for a promotion or two
Yes, absolutely. Ask for a mentor, ask for an assessment. Absolutely no harm in asking, and the worst thing that can happen besides them saying 'no' is that they'll give you advice on how to deal with incidents, positioning etc. Heck, they can be a serious confidence boost if they turn up for a difficult game and tell you that you've been spot on for everything, especially early on in your career. So, go for it, any free assessments you get now will give you time to fix any issues ready for when you apply for promotion.
 
#8
Well done for opening up about this. You’ve great answers above about your specific questions. Of course, yes, ask for a mentor and get assessed. You can only get so much feedback here!

Your starting point is quite chellenging: reffing games for “your” club. There are always going to be complications. Ideally, you would be out doing different teams in other leagues, and you’d get more perspective on every aspect.

Take heart as well. 15 games is very little. You seem confident as you know football and you are able to get through 90 mins and make difficult decisions. But... a mentor can help with your development areas that in the end will help your match control. It took me a few years to stand up straight, stop waving too many arms about and learn enough to look and feel and be more like a referee.

Again, well done. Try to do different teams and fo work as an AR - fastest way to learn from others IMHO;)
 

one

RefChat Addict
#9
It was a long post but worth the read. Keep self assessing. It seems like one of your strengths.

A lot of good advice here. I will touch on a couple of things.

At grassroots abusive supporters impact the behaviour of players. They need to be dealt with. If the parents call you names for example and you do not deal with it, the player think they can get away with it too and start pushing their boundaries and before you know it things get out of hand. Don't let it escelate. I am not talking about things like "that was a foul", it's the personal stuff. Always go through team/club officials.

Questioning your own ability is nothing unusual. Every referee does it. Even experienced ones. Twice for me last season. Any referee who says they haven't done it either lies or is too c0cky :) It means you care about your refereeing and you want to get it right. Accept that you will make mistakes and experience will make it easier to deal with.
 
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#10
I apologise for the length of this post. [EDIT] this perhaps should be in Match Incidents. But as a reasonably new referee (qualified in the summer), I thought I'd post it here.

I have refereed a couple of handfuls of games now (15-20). Most have gone without any major incident. I do the refereeing for one club and most of the players, parents and managers know me quite well. I managed one of the teams for a number of years and stepped down last year.

However the last couple of games have been absolutely awful and I would like some advise about what I should be doing differently. These are U13 and U14 games, not adults. I am a 30 year old adult so can handle most people around the pitch, but we do have a 16 year old who does referee this age group - which concerns me.

First game - U13s;

The game was 0-2 and there were are couple of decisions I made. A key one was one player (away) jumped (barged) into the back of someone, I gave a free kick to the home team. Explained to the child that side to side without being excessive is fine, but not through the back. Parents were not happy with it but let it go. However 5 minutes later the same player (away) was running alongside another player (home, who had the ball), tripped over his own feet and I carried on play. The parents were furious that I didn't give the away team a freekick. I still don't know why they were complaining. The game continued for another couple of minutes and the ball went out for a corner to the home team. One parent in particular was excessively shouting. I paused the game to go and speak to him. At this point there was 4 minutes until full time.

My mistakes - I went over the sideline and asked the spectator to calm down because I am the referee, I make the decisions and he needs to respect everyone on the pitch, not be so angry his face had gone red (I didn't say the latter). He did not shut up. I then asked him to leave the area. He refused. I asked him once again as I could not continue with this abuse and I would abandon the game. He continued, refused to leave. I abandoned the game. The manager spoke to me and asked me to continue the game for the sake of the children. I should have spoken to the manager before speaking to the spectator (mistake one). I agreed to continue the game (mistake two), but would be reporting it. I did report it to the league and the local FA. The game ended 1-2 (the home team scored in those last 4 minutes). The home team were happy with my refereeing.

Second game - U14s

Parents shouting and commenting on some decisions from the other side of the pitch. I ignore. There was then a crunching late tackle by a home player, side on, clipped the ball but took the player first, sliding. I quickly blew my whistle and gave a free kick. I did not give a caution (but should have), I did speak to the player and he apologised straight away. A few away players were then constantly sarcastic towards me, and generally were cursing during the game. I spoke to the linesman (away parent) at half time and said yes it should have been a caution, but I cannot go back and change my mind. He understood this and mentioned that he thinks I am losing control.

A minute into the second half one of the away players then went sliding in, nowhere near taking the ball and going straight for the player. The player was cautioned. His parent was then furious with me. The manager then substituted that player.

I then had another 20 minutes of shouting from the sidelines, sarcasm from away opposition of being biased. At one point I had a parent shout "You are a s*** referee".

Overall, the away team had approximately 15 free kicks, all of them were niggles, a couple of handballs. Nothing malicious or really purposeful, just some players on the home team weren't very good footballers. The home team only had a couple of free-kicks during the game. I did not give the away team a penalty when the ball hit a home players arm (the arm was down by his side and the ball hit him from 5 yards). The law states the handball has to be deliberate so I did not give it. I stand by this decision.

My mistakes - after the game I tried to explain to the players firstly, that yes the first half should have had a caution for the challenge, but that does not mean they can start retaliating and I had to put a stop to it. Some of their players were very nice and said thanks for explaining and parents were nice. Some players complete opposite and continued to be sarcastic. I then went and spoke to the parent who was shouting abuse at me, he did not take kindly to this and said he has been playing football for years and he can say what he likes to me when I am refereeing. I then explained that it an U14s game and this is not the same as an adults, I do not expect swearing from players and I expect all spectators to behave and support everyone on the pitch. Eventually he calmed down and just said that I should learn how to speak to people.


----

So my questions

- Am I right in sticking to my guts from Game 1 and abandoning the game? In future I will obviously speak to the manager first. But should I just accept that parents will be constantly shouting at me? I hadn't really had it before.

- Should I accept U13s and U14s swearing (not necessarily at me) during the game? Personally if that was my child I would not be happy and therefore count it as foul and abusive language. But the Laws of the Game it is a sending off. I am still not sure what to do in this case. If the swearing was directed at me, it would be a straight sending off, but if it's general swearing?

- In the first game I did give a caution for dissent. If a player disagrees with me and says so, I can accept. But this was constant from one player and after I told him he needs to stop, he continued. The caution then came. Do I stamp out ALL chatting back and give cautions? Or do I let them have a small tantrum at a decision. I find it difficult to think what should I just ignore and what should I caution for.

- Is it worth asking the local FA for another more experienced referee to come and mentor me? I am an adult, and refereeing children's games, but the last two games have made me start questioning my ability. I wouldn't say I am aiming to be a Premier League referee, but would look for a promotion or two

- Both games the home team were happy with my performance. But I am not sure if they are just saying this because they know me. They have asked me to referee instead of the younger 16 year old referee they have because he hasn't been as forceful as me on fouling (even though I STILL get shouted at my spectators)

If you managed to get here, thank you very much.
Just be brave in your decision making, the dads never got their chance to play for England and when they see a younger Ref making a
decision against their Ronaldo Son they seem to want to Ref the match for you. Blow that whistle hard, make the dads hear you with confidence and if still no good talk to the managers which you did tell them before kick off to help control outside interference.
Still no good you've done your best abandon only option.
 
#11
A big thank you to everyone who has responded.

Just a few things

- My question on chatting back I will say mainly has come because the players only seem to follow their parents. I have found that teams where there are non abusive parents have a much better game than the ones that do. I will follow the stepped approach. Some games have been great to referee and even the parent linesman's have been good and helpful

- I will avoid all spectators. I will outline my expectations to managers before the game. No foul language towards myself or other players.

- I will ask my County FA and Local Referees Association for a couple of observations.
 

Ciley Myrus

RefChat Addict
#12
You will find, as discussed on here often, although its not strictly a rule, better behaved the sideline, better behaved the players and same in reverse.
This in turn can indeed to if not a better, certainly a more enjoyable game for all. You need to remember as referee at this level, its a hobby and folk do hobbies because its something that they enjoy.
 

Justylove

RefChat Addict
#13
A big thank you to everyone who has responded.

Just a few things

- My question on chatting back I will say mainly has come because the players only seem to follow their parents. I have found that teams where there are non abusive parents have a much better game than the ones that do. I will follow the stepped approach. Some games have been great to referee and even the parent linesman's have been good and helpful

- I will avoid all spectators. I will outline my expectations to managers before the game. No foul language towards myself or other players.

- I will ask my County FA and Local Referees Association for a couple of observations.
When you use the stepped approach, remember its not a conversation or a nice chat, its about you being clear that they are treading a very fine line. You can be polite and respectful, but assertive. I tend to finish up my formal talking to with a player with "We won't be having this conversation again". For me, this works on 3 levels:

1) If the player wants to carry on afterwards, you can go straight to card - 9/10 the other team mates are going to get on his/her back because they've ignored a warning
2) Next time they do it, you can easily sell the card
3) If you give the bo****king loudly enough, it makes it easier to sell a card whomever it may be as you've set your stall out

One point to iterate - you mentioned Foul & Abusive Language - get into the correct terminology. Foul & Abusive Language is not the offence as stated in The LOTG. The offence is Offensive, Abusive or Insulting Language or Behaviour, shortened to OFFINABUS. Its an important differentiation and one you need to be clear on.
 
#14
A lot of posts on here recently regarding bad parents all seem to be focused around U13 and U14 games, i dont know if that is purely a co-incidence but seems to be happening a lot.

The ASK, TELL, REMOVE steps should be followed when it comes to noisy parents, coaches but depending on the comments-abuse you can skip the ask and tell and go straight to remove.
 

Big Cat

RefChat Addict
#15
In my limited experience, I'm not convinced by the 'stepped approach'. By the time the steps are taken, the ref might have fallen down the stairs
Only warn a player if they're teasing on the verge of dissent, but don't faff about if they bypass the flirting stage
 
#18
Really interesting post Lokolo, very similar situation to myself.
I'm about 10-15 games in, just doing youth games and having some similar issues, game control, gobby parents etc.
Read all the replies with interest, thanks guys.
 

Tino Best

RefChat Addict
#19
Cards are there to be used at youth level they will shut the players up, when the yellow cards come for managers next season that will make a difference as they know they are walking a tight rope, gobby parents if they are abusive ask the relevant coach to deal with it and if they don't abandon. Their kids will not be happy with them if they can not have their game of footie. We have the tools at youth level refs need to use them. I know a ref who has been reffing for 6 years only doing youth and has never used his red card. The issue with that is when I caution and dismiss I get more greif although I don't care because last week he wasn't booked for that. I rarely do anything below under 15s as well as OA and my card count is averaging about 2.5 yellows a game I reckon U18s at the weekend 3 AA 1 FT 1 C2 and 1 PI. All deserved what was my club mark? Who knows but I was right to issue those cautions so if I am slated for doing my job so be it
 
#20
A big thank you to everyone who has responded.

Just a few things

- My question on chatting back I will say mainly has come because the players only seem to follow their parents. I have found that teams where there are non abusive parents have a much better game than the ones that do. I will follow the stepped approach. Some games have been great to referee and even the parent linesman's have been good and helpful

- I will avoid all spectators. I will outline my expectations to managers before the game. No foul language towards myself or other players.

- I will ask my County FA and Local Referees Association for a couple of observations.
Don’t doubt yourself, at the end of the day people opinions differ. However I wouldn’t walk in to the parent place of work and shout dogs abuse at them for making a mistake.

I would strongly recommend you give Lisa a call (your profile says your B&B) she’s is a great person to talk to about this. I don’t believe they have an academy but there will be someone who can come and watch
 
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