A&H

Just A vent

B

boblardo

Active Member
Level 5 Referee
I apologies in advance as this will be a bit of a rant thread but I really have no where else to vent

After taking around 2 years out, I've returned to refereeing. A decent pre season has got me up to match speed and yesterday was my first competitive fixture.
Now this fixture is notorious for being quite feisty so thought neutral assistance would be appointed but alas not.

Anyway, the game started and i'd decided to be firm on even the soft fouls to set my stall out early which settled the game down for about 10 minutes although we had lots of moaning. Both club assistance being "loose" with the offside rule which caused some frustration but as they had a better view of the line than I, supported their decisions. Obviously the attacking team full backs were able to see the offsides better than everyone else and the strikers are never offside either!!

We get through around 15 minutes before the away team score a goal. A throw-in which the home team feel is awarded incorrectly leads to a well worked goal. 1-0 to the away side. Then the temperature of the game heats up which leads to an easy caution for the home team for stopping a promising attack, although the away 18 took the opportunity to tell me that I am not protecting players and thats an YC, a quick word to him seems to appease the situation. A few moments later an away player is fouled, as I call in the home player to caution him the away 18 decides to tell me AGAIN that this is an obvious YC and I need to get control of the game. YC issued for USB to 18 followed by the caution for the home 16. No real complaints here so we continue on, staying sharp on the whistle and just a minute before half time I award a penalty for the home team. Lots of comments from home team that its 100% a penalty and obviously the away team clearly feel it was either not a penalty or soft. Penalty converted to make the score 1-1 and away keeper decides to shout "you are a f**king disgrace ref", a clear as day red card issued much to the goalkeepers apparent shock. "I wasn't talking to you ref, im just frustrated". The half ends 1-1.

Second half starts much the same way and after the away team are awarded a freekick Home 7 decides to kick the ball away some distance, so a caution for delaying the restart follows. I start to loosen the game a little and as the away team play a ball through the Home GK runs out to intercept, misjudges the bounce and clearly hand balls it in order to prevent the away striker getting through on goal. Game stopped, direct freekick awarded and red card issued to GK for dogso.

More end to end football before another penalty awarded, away winger is fouled outside the box but retains composure, i play advantage and he's fouled in the box and for me an easy penalty. Obvious dissatisfaction from home team but now a melee starts on the opposite side of the pitch between the subs and one apparently walks on and slaps the away team full back. Bear in mind this out of my view as I've just been running away from it towards the penalty area so haven't seen anything but at this point everyone is telling me how I've lost control of the game, what am i going to do about it etc. I speak to the apparent perpetrator and his team manager as well as the perceived victim and this manager (separately of course) and explain that while I haven't see whats been alleged, I will make a note in my pre match report. That said it couldn't have been nasty as it settles down very quickly and we look to resume with the aforementioned penalty but not before the home team try to take advantage of the situation.

Penalty scored 1-2.

5 minutes later and its the turn of the away team to feel aggrieved, as the gk fouls the attacker, sweeping his standing leg when trying to play the ball. Penalty awarded and while some people were frustrated there weren't too many complaints from players in close proximity

Penalty scored 2-2

What else could happen with just 4 minutes to go, well home team 4 decides to make a reckless tackle. I immediately blow for a freekick with the intention of cautioning but before I am able to issue the away skipper decides he's allowed to run up to me and tell me I am not protecting players, i respond by saying 1) i immediately gave a freekick 2) before I could issue any further action you've confronted me please allow me to take action. We then have a 2 minute back and forth about with him stating "ive listened to you can you listen to me" but he isn't actually listening to what I am saying so promptly end the conversation and proceed to caution the home team 4.

Home team 6, who is on his last warning, is cautioned for persistent infringement and just before the game peters out to its conclusion the away team break into the box, away 14 goes down under some pressure but not enough for me to award another penalty and the players body language also suggest no penalty. Obvious it is a penalty though!

In truth I could have had around another 4/5 cautions late on in the game but tried to manage it but it got to the point I just stopped talking to the players as they weren't interested in reason.

A shame really as both teams are very good and when the focussed on playing football it was an enjoyable game.

Nothing really needed here, it was a tough game and just needed to get it off my chest. Funny how players look to be blameless in everything and it became quite frustrating when players started fouling opponents, see the freekick awarded against them, start being petulant. I don't know if its a generational thing but WOW, its worse that i've ever seen it. Such an entitled bunch nowadays who don't like having things go against them

If that is how its going to be every week it will be the shorted come back ever
 
The Referee Store
Appreciate it is intended more as a vent than as a request for learning points, but I was surprised to read that after obviously and persistently disagreeing with your approach, away 18 went into the book for USB? Reads like stonewall C2 dissent and a 10 minute sin-bin (assuming you're in the UK) to me.

And while I don't love sin bins, if the overall vibe towards the end of the game is "This ref doesn't know what he's doing", that's going to be amplified by applying the wrong sanctions even if they are happier with the individual decision being wrong. Ditto the captain at the end, having a 2 minute conversation with him is only serving to justify his feeling that he's entitled to rant at you, that should have been shut down much quicker.

There's an overall sense in your account of you being frustrated about complaining but not stopping it. The referee sets the standard for how much backchat is allowed - while sending the GK for his outburst shows how you'll deal with really egregious OFFINABUS, I don't get the sense that you were as clear with with players regarding how much low-level ongoing dissent you were OK with?

Having said that, I don't disagree with @OIREF! - any game where both GKs are sent off and multiple penalties are required is always going to be on the more challenging end of the spectrum! I still have my last-season stats in my signature and as you can see, 2 red cards per game is well above the going rate. Some games are just tougher than others and every so often, the nature of statistics means one of those is going to fall at the hands of someone who is just starting out or just returning from a break.
 
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@GraemeS thanks for taking the time, I gave the caution for USB as it was more repeatedly asking for an opponent to be cautioned which I guess falls into either bucket, but point noted.

Honestly, I think if I told them the sky was blue they would have argued it wasn't. The whole thing isn't helped by it being two distinct ethnic groups who have a clear history and dislike for each other hence the nature of the game.

I did 10 preseason games and had no need to use the Red Card so it certainly isn't the norm
 
Great report. Well done. TBH sounds like a great match to referee! High level of difficulty.

So, what could you have done differently, could you have identified and acted on low level dissent earlier?

With the big decisions, how was your timing, body language, movement… did you sell well?

Great point on the entitlement of the new generation. TBH I haven’t noticed it with players but I did notice it with an international young group of officials. It is a thing. And could well change on field dynamics.
 
santa sangria said:
Great report. Well done. TBH sounds like a great match to referee! High level of difficulty.
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I enjoyed the game, the adrenaline was still pumping when I got home.
santa sangria said:
So, what could you have done differently, could you have identified and acted on low level dissent earlier?

With the big decisions, how was your timing, body language, movement… did you sell well?
Click to expand...

WRT to the big decisions, for all the penalties i was in a very credible position, well in the immediate vicinity and was able to apply reasoning immediately and for the most part there was little argument. There is always some discontent around these decisions but nothing that really came across as out of order. Same with the red cards, the offinabus drew a comment from the sideline "you've ruined a good game" but again players near the GK had little argument or comment to make. Same with the dogso, there were a few shouts about players covering but thats normal in these scenarios.

WRT to the low level dissent, there is some development here for sure. It was clear from the outset that players on both teams were going to push the boundaries so the decision was made early to keep it tight and give even the soft fouls, intending to loosen it up as the players start behaving. But even giving the soft ones drew feedback then when you "loosen" it up a bit you get "why have you not given that but given that one etc" despite the offences being 10mins apart and if you pull that up you'd have all 22 in the sinbin at some point. However it certainly is a learning point and maybe an opportunity to rest the radar on whats acceptable (ie frustration) and what's dissent
 
boblardo said:
I enjoyed the game, the adrenaline was still pumping when I got home.


WRT to the big decisions, for all the penalties i was in a very credible position, well in the immediate vicinity and was able to apply reasoning immediately and for the most part there was little argument. There is always some discontent around these decisions but nothing that really came across as out of order. Same with the red cards, the offinabus drew a comment from the sideline "you've ruined a good game" but again players near the GK had little argument or comment to make. Same with the dogso, there were a few shouts about players covering but thats normal in these scenarios.

WRT to the low level dissent, there is some development here for sure. It was clear from the outset that players on both teams were going to push the boundaries so the decision was made early to keep it tight and give even the soft fouls, intending to loosen it up as the players start behaving. But even giving the soft ones drew feedback then when you "loosen" it up a bit you get "why have you not given that but given that one etc" despite the offences being 10mins apart and if you pull that up you'd have all 22 in the sinbin at some point. However it certainly is a learning point and maybe an opportunity to rest the radar on whats acceptable (ie frustration) and what's dissent
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I’m fishing for e.g. stepped approach early in the game, including taking the opportunity to, for example, put on a show with a clear warning to a player that everyone understands.

There’s the other thread about sanctioning dissent by stopping the game while the ball is in play. Sometimes the match needs this.
 
it is a fine line @GraemeS . I think if it is dissent against your decision then a C2 sin bin. Reading between the lines, I think that @boblardo cautioned due to the constant request for a card as C1 (UB).

These games are always absolute mind destroyers: they are hard work and often have you thinking about what ifs and buts.

Sounds like you had the bottle to deal with all key match incidents and issued correct disciplinary.

As @santa sangria mentioned, in some games with high temperature, don’t feel like you have ‘failed’ if players make the choice to behave dissentfully! It is their choice. An early C2 sin bin can make it clear that you will stand for no nonsense. Also - well done for S6 for the GK!!

Sounds like a tough game! Have a nice beer/wine (or alcohol-free equivalent) to celebrate not being last week’s Ref.
 
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It sounds to me like you did a good job under difficult circumstances. I don't think you sound like this game has made you want to throw it in. What I would like to say to the many refs who complain that players' attitudes have made them want to leave the game, is simple...referee ladies games! I have been doing this for 11 years now and don't miss any of the spite and bile I saw in men's football. There is less cheating, less backchat and players even sometimes apologise for fouls! Don't get me wrong, there is still some nastiness and bad behaviour, but just enough to keep things edgy and not enough to make me want to hang up my whistle. I thoroughly recommend this to referees who hate the violence both physical and verbal that has entered the men's game. Of course, many referees I speak to say they would hate the relative quiet of the female game. Horses for courses.
 
If only footballers would just play football and not use a match to behave like they're in the House Of Commons. :rolleyes:

I had a similar sort of match this week, not as hectic or stressful as the OPs but similar.

I know that these come along every now and again as a matter of course but on Tuesday night I felt like a school teacher, parent of an angry teenager and a social worker all at the same time ... :wall:
 
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