A&H

"Handbags" - what code for yellow card?

RefJef

RefJef

RefChat Addict
Quick bit of advice needed (may eloborate later, but want to get my paperwork done.)

Booked two players today for a bit of shoving and squaring up the each other ("handbags" in MOTD parlance)

Should I put them through as C2: dissent by (word and) action, or C1 USB?

An interesting game I'll probably post about later, but a quick answer to the above would be a great help.

Many thanks

Jeff
 
The Referee Store
RefJef said:
Quick bit of advice needed (may eloborate later, but want to get my paperwork done.)

Booked two players today for a bit of shoving and squaring up the each other ("handbags" in MOTD parlance)

Should I put them through as C2: dissent by (word and) action, or C1 USB?

An interesting game I'll probably post about later, but a quick answer to the above would be a great help.

Many thanks

Jeff
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If it's not directed at you or an AR, I don't think you can justify C2. That sounds like textbook USB (AA) to me, for both of them.
 
Thanks - perfect.

As soon as I logged on to the whole game system and saw the additional codes for USB it became obvious. As you say, C1 (AA)

(Have made a note of those for future reference)

Many thanks
J
 
Given Match of the Day's legendary ignorance of the LOTG, I would be considering how much force was used and what area of the body was pushed/shoved before I was cautioning.

A lot of "handbags" is actually Violent Conduct but referees are conditioned to downgrade it due to expectations of players/managers who believe what they hear on Match of the Day!
 
I hear what you are saying @Padfoot and I wish, like MOTD, I could now rewatch the incident several times over to establish exactly what happened. Whether or not I was right or not in respect of the LOTG (and, I think, based on what I saw, I was) I did the right thing in terms of the game today.

Bottom tier of local OA league and in 12 games each so far this season, home side had won 1, away side 2. On a wet December afternoon, this was never going to be el-Classico.

I'll hold my hands up, on reflection I should have booked yellow 10 on 20 mins for a bad tackle - he was done by the pace and skill of a youngster, bringing him down as he turned and beat him: to be fair, probably due more to incompetence than malice, but worthy of a card. Shrill blow of the whistle. Call him over, he takes his time as he's apologising to the fouled player, apologises to me etc., everything's calmed down as I speak to him and he escapes his card. I hold my hands up, I got this wrong. I didn't bottle it, but a wily old "pro" has worked me. Learning pooint noted.

10 mins later same yellow 10 (age 30+) and red 7 (barely out of his teens, if at all) are contesting a 50/50 ball on the ground. Bit physical, neither really gaining control of ball, both probably committing a foul, but hard to call who to penalise. Ball squirts away from them into empty space, should be the end of it, but out of my perpiphal vision I notice them still tangling with each other. Both start shouting/swearing at each other ...

BIG blow of the whistle. I go over to the side of the pitch (backwards, keeping "eyes on") and call them both over. Notice circa 4 other yellows also heading my way. "Erhm, could get interesting" I think. "Away you go the rest of you, yellow 10 and red 8 please. And I'll have the skippers as well" Pause. Im happy for everything to calm down, I'm in no rush. Speak to them all. Explain how we'lI restart (free kick red, was in their half.) issue cards. Take my time filling in my book, amble over to ball to restart.

Tempers remained high for a few minutes, but I worked hard to calm it all down, lots of preemptive warnings, slowed it all down, praised yellow 6 and red 5 for good sportsmanship after they accidentally collided (muddy pitch), helped each other up and shook hands. Was pleased to note a couple of experience old heads on red calming their 7 down, shuffling him round the pitch to mark someone different from yellow 10.

Game continued as a well contested affair, with yellows ending up winning 4-3, with all happy at the end, everyone having enjoyed an afternoon on the football pitch rather than fighting the masses Christmas shopping. A really good game for me to have to referee today - I had to work hard on my game management, but think I did well and I learnt a lot.
 
Its sometimes funny how 'handbags' escalates to 'all in' with the input of just one individual. These incidents usually follow a serious foul like a two footed tackle or an elbow. Trouble seems to follow certain hotheads and its worth doing your damnedest to isolate that player asap. Learn who these players are as this will help later, leopards never change their spots!!
I'm quite a tall, heavy boned ref and have found using my ample sample in the melee as a peacemaker a benefit. If all hell breaks loose then get the hell out of there. This may not be FA coaching policy but it usually works for me...
 
Padfoot said:
Given Match of the Day's legendary ignorance of the LOTG, I would be considering how much force was used and what area of the body was pushed/shoved before I was cautioning.

A lot of "handbags" is actually Violent Conduct but referees are conditioned to downgrade it due to expectations of players/managers who believe what they hear on Match of the Day!
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agreed, i sent someone on saturday for shoving his shoulder into the face of an opponent during a 'squaring up'
he was very surprised as he thought he would be getting away with just a caution.
 
If you're going to caution both players for USB (AA), then pulling the captains in is not really going to add any value, imho.
 
Mewcenary said:
If you're going to caution both players for USB (AA), then pulling the captains in is not really going to add any value, imho.
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I'm not sure I'd agree that's always the case to be honest.

For an isolated incident that can be quickly dealt with, sure, there's not much point getting more people involved. But if (as was the case above) it looks like it's close to tipping over into a major incident, I can definitely see the benefit of getting the captains in and reminding them of their responsibilities to keep their players calm. And similarly, often one team will feel unfairly punished by a card for each side - having the captains there and explaining the decision is simply per-empting them running in and arguing the decision.
 
Mewcenary said:
If you're going to caution both players for USB (AA), then pulling the captains in is not really going to add any value, imho.
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As the man on the ground on the day, I think it did add value, for two reasons:

  1. It took another bit of time for the skippers to amble over, therefore taking a bit more heat out of the situation, and,
  2. Red 7 was a youngster who was being wound up by Yellow 10 - an old "pro". The red skipper was then pro-active for the next 5 mins or so, adjusting positions and who marked who etc. keeping his lad away from yellow 10 who was cute enough to have niggled him into a reaction that would have seen him walk for a second yellow (or straight red). To be fair, the captain may have done this without being involved in my chat, but then again, he may not.
 
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